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Sound on long-circulating version is decent, but probably not low-gen.
In March 2007, Duncan seeded his upgraded master clone to DIME. And if you can believe it, there's another master clone in existence which GaoBest received from a friend of the band.
BS: "Hi."
Bernard makes some noises before _Procession_.
Duncan's version fades in, so this is not heard on his version.
A fairly involved guitar solo here.
At about 1:05 somebody sounds like they're saying 'sorry'.
Lady can be heard giggling a bit on some of the audience versions. Duncan's version features the following conversation.
punter: "Is that a new one or a new one"
lady: "An old one"
taper (I think): "Oh, fucking good then."
punter: "I only know a few, c'mon."
Brief pause on the GaoBest version.
_Dreams___Never___End_
GaoBest version gets inadvertently paused during the intro.
BS: "Can I have some guitar through the foldback, please?" [a few more words muttered which I can't make out]
Hooky calls for "guitar" at 1:45.
More conversion on the Duncan version, with the girl saying "I've never really been into Joy Division."
_Truth_
Bit of a slow intro there.
Taper says "Just move this back a little bit."
_Mesh_
Hooky does his usual bit. 1:21, 1:26, 1:28-1:31, and 1:51-1:55 have dropouts, at least on my copy. But not on Duncan's.
BS: "We'd like to apologize for the feedback... What was I thinking? Is it all right?"
_The___Him_
Somebody yells out "Get it right" at the start.
Sound starts garbling up between 1:20-1:30 on my old copy, but not on Duncan's.
Very harsh guitars suggesting the mix was a bit of a problem.
The band tune up between this song and the next.
_Cries___And___Whispers_
Bernard sings this.
lyric: "Once, out of reach, we never speak, we never see"
Some person (higher pitched reedy male voice) says something which I can't make out.
BS: "What?"
Same person: "You seem a little bit down to me. [couple more words I can't make out]" Could also be "of that one" instead of "a bit down", or something else entirely, don't know.
_Ceremony_
BS: "Anybody got anything to say? Or are you just going to [can't make out the rest]..."
The set closes off with a nice, boingy _Senses_.
Recording posted to DIME by Duncan in March 2007.
The opening track is _Ceremony_.
PH: "Turn the foldback...on the wedges."
BS: "Turn the guitar up through the foldback as its feeding back."
_Mesh_
Great guitar riffing here, though it overwhelms the song near the end.
_Truth_
BS: "Well, well, well. We're not going to play any Joy Division songs. What you'd do an encore for."
BS: "This one's called Truth, though."
The fans comment about this pronouncement.
The melodica and synth combo are piercingly, hauntingly beautiful here.
_The___Him_ follows.
_In___A___Lonely___Place_
Great-sounding growling synth at the start.
voice: "There's a little bit of distortion on the left hand side of the keyboard."
BS: "The left hand side of the PA has blown up, actually."
voice: "Oh, the PA...my God."
_Dreams___Never___End_ follows.
_Cries___And___Whispers_
There's feedback through the first verse.
BS: "Sorry about the silent party",
Neil O'Connor (who recorded the show) noted Bernard's wry comment, and that it was said, "as if to have a little dig at the crowd who were pretty much stood montionless, only offering reserved applause in-between songs.
_Senses_
voice: "Just like the Cure, that one...
BS: "Listen to that bass, woo. Electric drums, that."
Soundcheck
_The___Him_
BS: (2:05) "I need vocals [thru the] foldback."
_Senses_
Lots of boingy sound effects
PH: "One two. Give me this...one two, one two. Ho-kay, now. One two."
BS: "Okay, one...let's just re... that. One two."
The guitar riff to "Sweet Jane".
Bernard and Hooky one-two.
_Truth_
You take those cymbals down a little bit in the foldback. One two."
Hooky plays the bassline of Dead Souls through the drum machine line, really cool...before reverting back to the normal bassline of the song.
BS: (1:48) "One two"
Hooky cries out for "Jerry" and the song comes to a close, and someone says "this is the last song of..." and something about shouting.
BS: "That's all right, apart from that."
PH: "One two"
Only have one of the tracks (in MP3 form). Sound is downright dodgy. The whole thing has since shown up, with sound still dodgy.
TJ had the following description (based on 'An Ideal For Living'):
"Bombers Over Vienna opened, and Positive Noise were on second.
A terrible sounding gig, both at the gig and on recording, Bernard complained throughout about the PA system. They aborted Dreams Never End halfway through and tried it again after a Bernard tantrum, and he introduced Cries and Whispers as Atmosphere, but then added "we were gonna do that but because of the shit PA we can't". An encore of Ceremony topped proceedings. One of the worst sounding NO tapes there is!"
_In___A___Lonely___Place_
Hooky "one, twos" right before his vocal turn and through the cheering for the song they had just played, in preperation for the next song, _Dreams___Never___End_. Or at least the first run-through, which peters about after about two minutes.
They then start over, and this time make it through.
BS: "For fuck sake, get this fucking [something] straight onto that stupid [something else] now."
_Truth_
About 30 seconds in...
BS: "Oh, we got a drum machine now."
_Mesh_ follows...a very good rendition, actually.
_Procession_
Bernard cries out "What?" at about 0:52 in.
Tape fades out at this point.
_ICB_
BS: "...[something], man(?)"
_The___Him_
Bernard's vocals end up much louder than the music, probably at the point the PA starts to give out.
_Cries___And___Whispers_
BS: "Still like fucking shit sound...who was that?"
(As synths start up)
BS: "It's called Atmosphere..." (huge cheering) "Nononononono, sorry, no it's not. We're gonna do that before, but because of the shit PA we can't. Requires a [sounds like 'harsh military'] sound'.
Mark Refoy suggests he's talking about the bad sound.
Fades out.
_Senses_
Sounds like a different recording, more clear.
BS: "Sorry about the sound... [couple more words hard to make out]"
The bass drum here is especially loud.
BS: "Listen to that bass drum. Whoo! Electric drums, that."
Terrific guitar riffing here.
The track fades out, but not before a boost in the s
_Ceremony_
Some noodling with the amps.
BS: (hard to make out) "Sorry, changing out...interested in buying a drum? Well, look man, anyway...the enthusiasm...[word]...up"
Transferred from an old TJ tape.
_Procession_ starts out the set, and is followed by _Dreams___Never___End_.
This is followed by _In___A___Lonely___Place_. There's a bit of taper chatter at the start of this.
_Mesh_
New Order's final performance of this song, to be retired come Feburary's performances.
Hooky may say 'thank you' after this. Conversation around the taper then centers around a camera somebody had brought.
_Truth_
Bernard says something at the beginning that I can't make out. Still more chatter around the taper, including a comment on whether they'd be playing Bela Lugosi's Dead after this.
_The___Him_ features yet more taper chatter, and quite a bit of it, too.
Some tuning between tracks afterwards.
_Senses_
More tuning between tracks afterwards.
_Ceremony_
This skips on TJ's version.
Source is from kered5's master. Better than what you would expect from a dictation-type tape recorder. Also have a source from CW, recorded with a Sony TCS-300, featuring better sound, and more audiene chatter.
_In___A___Lonely___Place_ is first, followed by _Dreams___Never___End_.
At 3:00 on the CW tape, a girl yelps. There's quite a bit of audience chatter before DNE (somebody mentions Joy Division at one point), and feedback at 1:13 or so.
The end of DNE features somebody cackling, and a tiny bit of tuning.
_ICB_
Drumbeats sound like somebody stamping their feet on the floor.
BS: "There's no sequencer in the foldback."
Sequencer? 1981? Yup, that's what he says.
A tiny bit of guitar fiddling before the start of _Truth_.
A hiccup sound at the end. Barney bashes out some chords.
_Procession_ follows, and then _The___Him_.
More tuning and a "boing!" synth effect preceding _Senses_, that can also be heard during the song's intro.
Edit between Senses and _Ceremony_ (CW tape)
(on the kered5 tape)
And yet more tuning before Ceremony. One fan says something about it being the new single. There appears to be some bleed-through at the 2:10 point. There's also some talking from 3:10 through the next minute...whoever it is sounds perhaps upset at the brevity of the set?
Interesting note regarding screwup on Procession.
http://www.neworderonline.com/MessageList.aspx?ThreadID=14163
To summarize, it's reported that the Stockholm Monsters were the support, so the question was brought forth whether they had performed on _Procession_, but in fact it turns out to be a drunk Barney, with Hooky messing up a few times as well
(johnny james and Detweiler get credit for discussing this)
http://www.neworderonline.com/MessageList.aspx?ThreadID=14206
contains some more information regarding the tracklisting.
Tape starts with soundcheck versions of _Senses_ and _Truth_.
The band tune up at this point.
No comments through _ICB_. Barney tunes his guitar again after _Procession_.
Some lady starts chattering in a real thick brogue at the start of _Truth_. I can't make out a word. Hooky's makes an error here, or decides to alter the bassline a bit.
The band tune up again before _Senses_, in fact they're still tuning through the initial drum bit.
Cut between Senses and _The___Him_.
After The Him, somebody starts to chant something over and over a few times, it may have been "Gillian, Gillian!". Bernard replies with something about how "You have to shout out every night... [2 words]?...always following me around"...
More of the same chanting after _Ceremony_. No commentary by any of the band.
_Dreams___Never___End_ closes the set. A bit of PA noise after.
Soundcheck
_Senses_
Hooky says "synth through the foldback".
_Truth_
Some muttering about a drum machine.
Sounds 21 Feb 81
Live Review by Chris Burkham
(includes photo)
http://www.new-order.net/terminal1.demon.co.uk/NewSounds2-81live.htm
NOTES
Article identifies Gillian as Steve Morris' _girlfriend_. They've been together for a very long time, as this was written early 1981.
Definitely written by somebody sympathetic to their "cause".
Soundcheck tracks include instrumental Joy Division numbers like "Glass" and "Digital".
I remember that the AIFL tome mentioned that the PA was quadrophonic, which was said to be an experiment that failed.
The band starts off with _In___A___Lonely___Place_.
Some chatter after...weird metallic plucking afterwards.
Unusual start to _Dreams___Never___End_ with guitar playing a full minute and a half before Hooky's bass comes in.
Some more chatter and tittering, as there's another longish-break between tracks, which Stephen fills with drum fills.
_ICB_
Intro sounds a bit like Senses here.
_Truth_
Distinctive feature is a female punter commenting about the sound.
_Procession_
Weird guitar+keyboard intro.
BS: "...more guitar through the foldback...[can't make out rest due to the reverb]"
_The___Him_
The sound mix seems to do this one good. Hooky mutters something at about 2:25. Folks clap at 4:15, not knowing that the silence there wasn't the end of the song.
_Senses_
I love the spring-type sounds at the start. Stereo shift at about 3:05.
_Ceremony_ finishes out the set.
To quote from Mark Johnson:
"To the massive-but-short-lived cheers of the audience Bernard announced that the eighth song would be "Atmosphere", but he hastened to add 'We were going to do that, but because of the shit P.A., we can't.
Master recording courtesy of Duncan.
This is one where the band just play, there's very little interaction that you can hear here.
_Denial_
We have what sounds like bleed-through on the tape or somebody left Section 25 on stage.
This is followed by _In___A___Lonely___Place_ and _Dreams___Never___End.
A bit of an odd version, very guitar-heavy and Hooky doesn't sing "soul" at the end of the second verse.
_Procession_ follows.
_Truth_
Bernard strums his guitar, VU-like, during the intro, which really gets going with Hooky's driving bass, interrupted by a random feedback squall.
_ICB_ then follows.
_Senses_
The band tune up and take a small break to plug in guitars a bit between this and the final track _Ceremony_.
Soundcheck
Consists of three tracks.
_Doubts___Even___Here_
Initially titled, 'Tiny Tim', this is the first instrumental run through of this track. Very arresting, yet another case of the first time being the best.
_Denial_
At the time, this was known as 'Little Dead'.
_Truth_
This is just 'Truth'.
Quality of my version is decent. A better version from a different source tape (copy from the master) has recently surfaced.
New Order open the set with _Ceremony_.
Then comes _Dreams___Never___End_ with audience members asking and answering what song this is. Hooky's vocals are fairly clear in this one, though the opening bass riff stumbles a bit. They then roll into _In___A___Lonely___Place_.
Some audience chatter during the intro of _Truth_, to the effect that the track they were playing hadn't been released yet, but I'm not completely certain that's in fact what was said.
Bernard tunes his guitar a bit before _ICB_.
_The___Him_ follows. Rough edit before _Procession_.
(afterwards)
BS: "a bit more guitar through the monitor would be lovely... more guitar."
_Denial_ concludes the set. Second time it's ever played. It nearly sounds hopeful, and is quite a good version that has the crowd crying out for more, which they of course do not get.
NO: 27 MAR 81 Trinity Hall - Bristol England
Most commonly heard as part of "The Dream" bootleg.
Looks like this is the 27 Mar 81 Trinity Hall Bristol England gig. Sounded like a very rowdy crowd, too bad my high-quality headphones blew out, so I'm having to use external speakers to play the music through, which makes transcribing between-song patter a bit harder.
This happens to be documented at
http://slashmc.rice.edu/ceremony/neworder/no_disc/noboots.html#dream
(except that the second "Senses" is from the gig, not the first...)
Support was Tunnelvision.
Bass in _Ceremony_ during the bridge is badly out of tune.
Near the end of the song Bernard says "less guitar in the foldback."
_Procession_
BS: "Less guitar in the foldback."
Some punter yells "dross".
BS: "What?"
Punter yells "dross" again.
BS: "Come up here and aay that, cuntface. I cannot see through here. Stand up here, don't be afraid."
Another punter comments, "Talking doesn't swear".
(as Bernard is now able to survey the crowd)
BS: "You've got blonde hair!"
This episode is recounted in Mark Johnson's "An Ideal For A Living" book.
On one version, the taper or someone close to him talks (what he says I can't make out) as Bernard sings "It's a problem, you know".
_Dreams___Never___End_
Same punter as before repats his shout of "dross" .
BS: "You're fucking moving to the front, right, you fuck(?)."
_In___A___Lonely___Place_
Some audience chatter at the start of this.
_Truth_
BS: "This one...to foldback, foldback".
Taper or someone near him cries "hey".
_The___Him_
You can hear BS yelling twice for "a little bit more guitar"...and "a little more guitar though the foldback".
Person near taper comments, "That was magic."
_Senses_ follows.
More taper comments.
_Denial_ closes out the set.
Soundcheck
There are multiple separate sources. Their tracklists are as follows:
The "Denial" here is taken from 1981-04-10 Cedar Club B'ham and not this gig!
They are about eqivalent in quality.
Hard to make out the speaking in the first part.
Bernard says something about the foldback.
PH: "One two, one two...that's all right, Ozzie. One two. Drum machine. Getting old, right?"
voice (perhaps Ozzie): "We're getting old..."
PH: "Drum machine, Barney."
_ICB_ (vocal version) follows.
Hooky says something about the guitar to Ozzie about midway through.
Some comments about the wedgies afterwards.
Punter says "five quid"...
Then Hooky plays the bassline of what sounds like _Komakino_ but is really _Senses_, as the riffs are similar, and it really illustrates the link between the two songs. At 2:09, Bernard cries out, "more guitar."...long fadeout during the middle of the track.
_Senses_
(after)
BS: "Yeah, the guitar was right at the end there, if...if you keep the foldback level on the guitar like that was at the end, than that's alright."
Someone cries out for Hooky...Steve, Gillian.
Ozzie: "Yeah, turn it down a bit..."
BS: "Yeah...fuckin'...Can you give us as much top on the vocals as possible, Ozzie?"
Ozzie: "As much top as possible?"
BS: "Without feeding back."
Ozzie: "Yeah, well, the problem...feeding now..."
BS: "What?"
Ozzie: "We'll do that now...[mutter]
BS: "Okay."
voice: "Turn the foldback down...wait, WAIT!"
PH(?) (off-mic): "You don't get that many of 'em..."
The first source is a tape from the archives, which only contain the listed tracks, omitting Dreams Never End and Denial, at least according to Waterrat.
I've since received a much more clear version, with all of the tracks present. It may be from a second source.
Sound is hissy but is fairly listenable, being a bit bass-heavy. The hissiness may have been due to the recorder.
BS: "Don't cheer, Won't...after...visit..." (can't make out)
(the second source starts after this point)
_Doubts___Even___Here_
The debut of this song, first of eight times New Order perform this song. (they had stopped playing it by June 1981) Sung by Hooky. Great version, especially like the synth effects at the start.
Break at 0:51 on second source, the first being complete.
_Chosen___Time_
Debut of this song as well! Bernard yells out "I'll never know!". Features some soloing not heard in the album or later live versions.
There's an edit between the prior song and _Truth_ (likely the missing Dreams Never End).
_Dreams___Never___End_
Bit of a false start with the opening bass riff.
_Truth_ follows.
The next song is _In___A___Lonely___Place_.
Mark Johnson says that, "Bernard forgot the lyrics of IALP. He was singing along in the usual way, then he got to one passage and all that came from his mouth was a rather daft noise for the rest of the line. Finally, Peter came in and started singing to save him."
This is followed by _Procession_, and then _Senses_, which on my original tape is cut...
Last song is _Denial_. Garbles at 2:00 for about 20s. Mic bump at 4:00.
Taken from B. Vick archives, on a CH-sourced tape, whose master sounds fairly good. Too bad this is an Nth generation copy.
Another recording from Duncan has recently surfaced.
_Doubts___Even___Here_
Second performance of this song.
punter: "That was with the same voice..." (I think)
Nearly three minutes until Hooky's vocal, they may have been having mic problems of some sort. Some audience/stage interaction which I have to listen to closer.
Mic bump and a feedback squall at the end.
_Ceremony_
Some audience chatter at the end of this.
punter: "The last days, talked to him. And Nelson. And David."
another: "What were they playing?"
punter: "Who wants to get that?"
third: "Play one you know."
_Dreams___Never___End_
Hooky completely flubs the intro, and has to start again.
PH: "Can I get...with the foldback, please?"
BS: "More foldback for me."
_The___Him_
Very good version, long feedback squall near the end, right before Barney sings, "so tired."
_Truth_
The drum machine starts out really fast, but is slowed down to the proper pitch after the first measure.
More audience comments near the end.
Tape break (squeegie-like, no better way of describing the sound the old recorders would make) between this and the next track.
A slight bit of soundchecking.
_Chosen___Time_
Second performance of this number.
Bernard's vocals in the middle are pretty ropey. Sounds like they speed up during the bridge.
_Procession_
BS: "Can I get some more foldback, Ozzie? More foldback."
Bernard tunes up at the end of this. A couple of boing noises (synth tune-up?) can be heard as well.
_Senses_ follows.
Punter and friend chat during the intro of _Denial_.
Weird sound during the "terrifies me" line...and the same sound later on during the "I tried so hard line"...sounds a bit like static.
Hair-raising "inside of me" shouts.
Soundcheck
_Denial_
(afterwards)
Ozzy: "Steve - You okay with that - can you hear it?" (The last part of the sentence being shortened to "Can y'ear it?")
My version (which was what was identified as being from Reading) cuts out at this point.
SM: "Yeah. (Pause) It's alright"
Ozzy: (after a pause) "How about you Barney? Are you okay?" (The word 'about' is muffled by a cymbal noise)
BS: "Can you give us a bit more top on the vocals in the foldback?"
Ozzy: "Yeah we'll try that....(rest is too quiet to hear)"
_The___Him_ follows. The WR listing has it reversed in "real time".
_Doubts___Even___Here_ opens the set, the last time it would ever do so.
_Chosen___Time_
Stereo shift at 3:05 on TJ version.
Somebody barks right before the start of _Dreams___Never___End_.
_ICB_
During the intro, Bernard says something about turning the syndrum up.
At 2:42, there's a ripping sound.
_Senses_ follows, as does _Denial_ and _Procession_.
_Ceremony_
The TJ version is cut at about the 4:00 mark. An alternate version from ST is complete.
Last tape of the Scotland mini-tour, supported by The Visitors.
My version is a fairly poor audience tape.
Some audience chatter after the opener, _Ceremony_, Bernard appears to apologize for something, I can't make out what.
It could be at this point he says "this is God speaking, this is your death speaking". (unverified)
_The___Him_ follows, and then the fourth of the eight performances of _Doubts___Even___Here_.
_Truth_
PH: "We're..." [five words, can't make out rest]"
At end...
PH: "Move(?) back ...because the the foldback..."
Bernard utters a word.
_Senses_
Some woman calls out "Mark" or somesuch a few times.
_Dreams___Never___End_
Bass intro sounds a bit strange, like Hooky's not playing it on the six-string.
_Chosen___Time_ follows.
The intro to _Denial_ is a bit muffed.
Both this and _In___A___Lonely___Place_ have Bernard screeching.
Near the end Bernard starts to passionatly scream out lyrics, but due to the quality of the source tape I can't make anything out.
Recording courtesy of TJ via grende_l.
description:
"low-generation tape copy (slight hiss) of a very good audience recording, from TJ's vault; audience chatter abounds, but this won't detract from your listening pleasure, as this is an excellent performance (6 tracks that would end up on 'Movement' + 2 singles tracks). No sound-processing was done. There's a cut between Procession & Denial in the recording (all on one side of a C-45, though); strangely, after the cut the sound is much clearer for a short while, but by the time Denial starts there's no noticeable difference with the other tracks anymore."
_In___A___Lonely___Place_
Fade-in on the recording. Another version reveals Hooky saying, "One two, one two" over the fading-out PA backing track.
Quite a bit of audience chatter at the start, and throughout the track.
_Chosen___Time_ follows.
At the very start, Hooky strums bass really quickly to produce an interesting sound effect.
Last portion has additional synth part, which isn't typical.
_Dreams___Never___End_
PH: "One, two, could you turn these monitors and the drum down with the vocals?"
_Truth_
Male and female punters talking, difficult to make out what they're talking about. Hooky's bass starts in at 0:19 and dominates the intro, very impressive. Bernard's melodica starts up at 0:50, with Gillian's synth at 1:05.
More chatter between this and _The___Him_.
You can really almost make out the banter between the gent and lass before _Senses_.
_Procession_
Yet more chatter.
Barney appears to ad-lib shortly after the 2:00 point, or else this is an early example of swearing through a lyric.
_Denial_
BS: "Give me some lights [can't make out]...you...[??]"
Broadcast 18 JUN 81. My copy is a flickery PAL->NTSC dub, with tracking issues every once in a while.
Tracks:
_Dreams___Never___ENd_
_ICB_
_Chosen___Time_
_Denial_ (titled 'Little Dead')
_Ceremony_
_Truth_
Gillian's hair is fairly short, and she has a cute bowtie on the top. The band is po-faced and doesn't talk at any point. Morris' drumming at the end of Chosen Time and at the start of Denial is as always a high point.
Credits roll over the last part of Truth.
There's also a 21 minute tape of outtake tracks.
_Ceremony_
At the end Bernard mutters something I can't make out, that garners laughter and clapping.
Hooky then says something which I can't make out either. Barney strums his guitar in what sounds slightly like the Velvets' "Sweet Jane", there's a feedback squall, and then, the start of _Doubts___Even___Here_.
Mic bump at 2:52.
BS: "Someone's got a pee-pee lined...[don't understand]"
A member of the audience repeats this, in a questioning manner.
_Digital_
Very short (1:24) instrumental, with the starting portion garbled.
_Denial_
Much of this sounds distorted.
_Dreams___Never___End_
First take breaks down during first verse, voice says "Due to... [can't make out] we're gonna have to start again.
PH: "We're incredibly hung over. One two, one two...one two." (not sure if this is really what Hooky says). Some other chatter as well, and Barney says someting about "beautiful" and "you get to quiet down a bit"...which generate laughter.
_Dreams___Never___End_ is started over again.
Melody Maker 23 May 81
Interview by Neil Rowland
http://www.new-order.net/terminal1.demon.co.uk/NewMM5-81.htm
Purports to be the first interview New Order has ever given. Also includes account of Forum Ballroom gig
Also
http://www.new-order.net/terminal1.demon.co.uk/NewMM12-88.htm
Has a brief description of Bernard at this gig.
Before the first soundcheck track, there's a bit of dialogue.
BS: "Sure this little synth...mine's loud enough..."
PH: "Can I have a little more synth through my wedge?"
Soundcheck tracks include:
Truth
Ceremony
Performance:
Ceremony
The version I have starts with a girl giggling and asking what the time is.
Bernard than can be heard to say something to the effect that the band won't be playing any Joy Division songs tonight, notwithstanding that Ceremony started off as one.
Dreams Never End
Quite a bizarre version. It breaks down after about minute or so, after Hooky flubs the bass intro at the 20 second point, with the bassist stopping and only guitar and drums beying played.
Then the band jams something akin to a Buzzcocks tune before jamming back into the song they're supposed to be playing.
Truth
Has some weird noises at the end, achieved by Bernard scraping his strings. Lots of reverb on the vocals here.
ICB
Anarchic guitar jamming closes out the track, quite good!
A/B split at this point.
The band than power through the second half of their set, starting with:
Senses
...and then...
Chosen Time
The end of Denial has a eerie spoken word Bernard delivering the "chorus".
Ends with In A Lonely Place, which concludes with a lovely burst of feedback and synth drones.
Fairly poor re-EQed version of recording. A superior version missing all but the first couple secons of "Denial" surfaced on DIME in late February 2007.
Vocals and bass on _The___Him_ are very odd sounding, I suspect this runs somewhat fast. (referring to old version)
_Dreams___Never___Ends_ follows.
Fifth time they perform _Doubts___Even___Here_. A bit of audience chatter right before. Gets rousing approval, punter on old version says something between this and _Truth_, which is follwed by _ICB_.
The intro instrumental interplay here is outstanding, only marred by the vocals coming in late and being mixed low.
_Truth_
The quadrophonic sound seems to greatly benefit the drum machine FX here.
_ICB_
At one point here Bernard repeats "Je ne sais pas."
Break between _Procession_ and _Senses_ (old version).
punter: "Syndrum. Snare." And then a sentece I can't understand.
The DIME source cuts out after a couple seconds into _Denial_.
Bernard yells at the end of the song, and then moans at the end, and says a few words I can't make out.
Soundcheck
One of the older versions has _Love___Will___Tear___Us___Apart_. Duncan's newly surfaced version doesn't include that but does have the following:
_Chosen___Time_
Interesting synth line near end.
A bit of chatter between tunes.
_The___Him_
Start is cut.
Fairly hissy (though not muddy) sounding tape, but still fairly listenable. A Duncan recording with a soundcheck take of "Ceremony" has since shown up.
These tracks are prefaced on my source tape with versions of Procession and Dreams Never End (cuts after less than a minute) that are taken from an unknown gig, most likely either Chorley (03 Jan 81) or Plato's Ballroom, Liverpool (14 Jan 81) but could be any number of other dates if Procession wasn't the opener.
It's now believed that the soundcheck tracks (Denial and Senses) attributed to this gig are actually taken from Cedar Club Birmingham 1981-04-10 and Trinity Hall Bristol 1981-03-27 respectively. However, it does appear that there is a legit recording of _Ceremony_ being soundchecked.
And it seems there's at least two versions as Whiskybob on DIME has put up one that doesn't have all the cuts the first version does.
_The___Him_
The original version joins this track in progress (first part of the song is cut), but the newer version is complete.
There's a fair amount of talking through the intro of next song, _Chosen___Time_.
Ends in low-pitched filter sweeps.
_Dreams___Never___End_
At the end, a punter says, "Right, really nice...".
_Truth_
lyric: "Some people look down on me, I hope they're disgusted with what they see."
On the old version, the end of the song is cut, but is complete on the newer source.
_Procession_
At one point, Bernard sings "I don't know" during the "Destruction... devotion, it's all the same to me." bit.
_Senses_
Features a very prominent guitar solo bit.
A tape cut (old version, new one has no cut), and then New Order tunes up with Barney ranting about something...for over a minute before the start of the next tune, _Ceremony_.
BS: "Hey, you'll just have to wait while we tune up...[new version has a cut here] something to think about for all you futurists... especially the ones with ... coats(?) [here he makes _really_ weird vocal noises]... craft. If you don't understand that, you're not a Futurist."
Mark Johnson says that the point of this was to attack those who had identified or labelled the group as aligned with Futurism.
Out of the blue, Bernard SCREAMS "I'll break them down"...
New Order segue right into _In___A___Lonely___Place_.
(about 4 minutes in)
BS: "Bass Drum...[name]...turn the bass drums back up...just turn (up) the bass...everyone, New Order is sick of the stories...[something] I want everyone to be sick...just sick of the way...you just don't understand...[something] nuclear(?)...[something] nature...you should be sick...[something] acid...and then he goes completely unhinged on the Futurists, "you're just shit...you're just dirt, you're just scum, you're just filth, you're just sick...scum...dirt...sick-filled scum-filled, you... you're shit, you're shit, you're shit...[other mutterings] scoot back, you little shit" etc. The song comes to a close.
There's another edit in the tape. Apparently Section 25 come on and performs a long jam with New Order...sounding a bit like _Cries___And___Whispers_, but has Larry Cassidy (I think) on vocals, who sings a few lyrics. There's a small break for applause, and then the music starts up again, with the keyboards serving to define the melody, and then has a drum-only section, and some more Cassidy vocals before the tape cuts out.
Tape courtesy of 'nof586'.
_Instrumental_
This to me sounds like a reworking of Mesh, but incorporating elements of 'Sister Ray', especially with respect to the drumming. Excellent stuff.
_Procession_
A segue from the last track.
Bernard screeches after one of the verses.
The band tune up after the end, doing it for well over 30 seconds.
_Ceremony_ is played next.
_Doubts___Even___Here_
Played only two more times afterwards. None of these versions feature Gillian's part. Ends with drums.
_Truth_
Bernard wanders from the script at the 1:48 point, when he sings "Seems so glad they destruct" (rather than "to be here")
_Dreams___Never___End_
Stellar-sounding guitar from Mr. Sumner.
_ICB_
Again, great guitar work from Bernard.
Break in tape between this and _Senses_.
Then _Denial_, followed by another brief break.
The concert ends with _In___A___Lonely___Place_ which in and of itself is unusual, with an rendition to match.
Bernard says something at 1:40 I can't make out.
"I'm warm like a debt..." as he stumbles over the lyric shortly before the 3:00 point.
Shortly before 4:00: "Turn the microphone down...turn the bass drum up."
Followed by a few yelps.
Bernard than starts talking, which I can't make out.
Only two tracks that appear to be extant are from "A Factory Complication".
_Everythings___Gone___Green_
The debut for this song.
The lyrics are much unlike any version I've ever heard, but are too low in the mix to be able to properly decipher.
_Truth_
Nothing really special to note.
Many thanks to 'booomboom' for making this one available. One of the best '81 performances, IMHO.
A fade-in to _Truth_ opens the set.
Second to last ever performance of _Doubts___Even___Here_.
_ICB_ follows.
Somebody calls for "Incubation". They get _Dreams___Never___End_ instead.
_The___Him_ follows, quite a tight performance. _Procession_ comes next.
For some reason the LP bootleg ('Dreams Never End') leaves out _Chosen___Time_, but it is present on the master clone that 'booomboom' made available in April 2004.
Punter cries out for "She's Lost Control". Bernard says something, of which I can make out "brain-dead", before the band play a storming _Denial_.
False state to _Ceremony_. Fans yell out...
BS: "If any of you screwheads have any interest than to shout out..."
Bernard than says something about Joy Division, and "you realize that we're not trying to rip you off...I think it's tonight...". Would love for somebody to transcribe this part, it's bugged me for years.
Then a marathon version of _Everythings___Gone___Green_, the second time the group ever performed it. An amazing intro, only marred by a few dropouts at about the 2:15-2:20 point, and being faded at the 17:55 point (due to the reel length being about an hour, presumably).
_The___Him_ ends with a neat guitar coda.
The melodica solo on _Truth_ is a bit uneven.
Barney almost utters something at the end of _Chosen___Time_, sounds like "Hello".
_Everythings___Gone___Green_ here is over ten minutes.
Taken from the "Dead Bodie's(sic) Can't Sing" CD boot. The sound quality, unlike many of the 81 European gigs, doesn't suffer from boominess.
It's obvious that this has been mastered from a boot LP (probably the Radio Order Stockholm disc) due to the scratching and crackling in a few places. Otherwise, the sound is very good.
_Ceremony_
PH: (about a minute in) "Gillian's guitar...foldback's..."
Audience members are pretty vocal between songs here.
_Dreams___Never___End_
(at the end)
BS: "Needs a bit of er, snare drum...over in the front..."
_The___Him_ follows.
_Truth_
The band were having equipment problems, making the intro on this song very different than how it normally gets played.
BS: Can't hear(?) the bass guitar's coming through the Vox down...through the Vox."
_ICB_
It almost sounds like 'Cries and Whispers' for a second, lots of scratching in the first part.
The song has some very distinctive riffing/soloing from Bernard.
_Chosen___Time_
Fast tempo.
About midway into things, Bernard inserts the following couplet:
People up and down
People in the city
People like you blink[?] and shout
Make me sick!
_Denial_ segues into _Everything's___Gone___Green_, which is the prototype 10+ min jam version. One version fades out after 12 1/2 minutes, another just cuts out.
lyric: "One two three four, everybody hit the floor Five six seven eight, everybody spewing hate!"
There's a bit of Giorgio Moroder/Donna Summer's "I Need Love".
BS: (at 8:25) "In five seconds, ...your help from below. Nice people..."
Here's a transcription...the wording in certain places is very uncertain.
Hearing the love from above
And shooting it up ... the world[?]
Position[?] it all above
Destruction brought up below
By the boardwalk
By the boardwalk
Down by the boardwalk
Down by the boardwalk
Where all you people go
They destroy you sa...
Down by the boardwalk
Where people go...
Down by the boardwalk x5
Woo woo woo woo
(with syncopated mouth drum sounds]
Down by the boardwalk!
Down by...
One two three turn around
All you people upside down
One two three
One three four
Everybody hit the floor
One two three four
Everybody hit the floor
Five six seven eight
Everybody's feeling great
Woo!
By the boardwalk
Where all the hip people go
By the boardwalk
You people are so slow!
I'm waiting from up above...x3
I'm in love x4
(melody of 'I feel love' by Donna Sunner
I'm in love
I'm in love x4
I'm in love x4
Wooooo...
[Bernard yelps]
Down by the boardwalk...
In five seconds
You'll receive your help from below
Where nice people don't like you go...
Wooooooo...woohoowhoohoo
Wooooooo...woohoowhoohoo
[More yelping]
I have two seperate MP3 versions of this (both 128k CBR), one from the audio anthologies, the other downloaded from Soulseek. This review is based off of the Soulseek collection, I haven't done an A/B comparison, but I suspect the Soulseek version has better SQ. Both version seem to have the same whooshing effect caused by excessive noise reduction.
Since picked up a lossless copy that is definitely the same source as the Soulseek MP3s, but somewhat better sound.
_Denial_
BS: "Ed, drums through the foldback."
Dropout on right channel for a few seconds at about 0:36-0:44.
BS: (lyric)"...stain on my windows." More bass!
He then yells "Outside me!"
_The___Him_
BS: Screams out "Shut up!" during the break in the song.
_Doubts___Even___Here_
The last time New Order ever play this one.
The end of _Senses_ has some weird repeated noise.
Not much more than this to report, they basically just play the songs with little audible crowd interaction.
Mark Johnson says that the PA crew was affiliated with 10CC and that New Order's short set was directed at how they were bragging that their band could play for 2 1/2 hours compared to New Order's 45 minutes.
http://www.angelfire.com/ga/zza77/temp/oslo.htm has a detailed review of this gig.
This performance exists in a number of formats.
One of the performances on the fabled 'Dreams Never End' 3xLP bootleg. Includes the complete perfornamce.
Audio from New Order Anthology Volume 5, with "Senses" mislabelled as "Chosen Time".
Also missing some tracks ("Truth", "IALP")
The rarest is a video, shot in near black-and-white with flickering due to it being an early PAL to NTSC mastering job. Definitely not a pro shot, *way* too many shock jerk zoom in and outs. Sound is distorted in the bass rumble direction, and is in mono, and may have been taken from a copy of a bootleg, as there is crackling, though the sound seems not to have been re-EQ'ed, as it now appears to have been in my copy of the 'Dreams Never End' bootleg. Video quality is murky, to say the least (on par with FACT37). Bernard has a strange far away stare, probably chemically induced. More closeups of Steve Morris than normally seen in these sorts of things.
Video starts with _Dreams___Never___End_ (the first two songs apparently no having been filmed). Gillian is initially barely present.
_The___Him_
Would this be the first recorded instance of the "woo"?
The Him: "Some days you waste your life away...whoo!"
_Ceremony_, _Truth_, and _ICB_ follow, the latter featuring excellent guitar interplay. Volume suddenly rises for a second at the 4:47 point.
Tremendous bass feedback that starts between _Senses_ and _Procession_... it drowns out much of the latter song.
Intense version of _Denial_. _IALP_ has more bass rumbling, and an improv sequence near the end.
Despite press propaganda, New Order did play encores in the early days. The whistling and cheering is nearly deafening as the bad eventually make it back on for _Everything's___Gone___Green_, and more headache-inducing zooming.
Featured is Ian's Vox guitar, which Bernard plays on for the duration of the song. About midway during the song, there's an edit and the camera angle changes. Near the end of the song, Bernard appears to be chatting to Gillian for a bit, then he straps his guitar and returns to what he was doing. Even with the edit, the song is nearly 9 minutes long.
Some more information about the master, from "booomboom" in the sharingthegroove.org forums:
Originally posted by snotters:
Fantastic! Can't wait - Roskilde 84 is a great gig too. Brilliant versions of Sunrise and Perfect Kiss. But then most of the 84 gigs were great (pre-Lowlife).
Booom, did you digitise Berlin 81 at all?
[His reply, unedited]:
No,and I have a little problem with that. The original was taped by a Uher reel to reel ,I have the reel to reel tape , but my reel to reel machine ( I hope , that's the right word ) is not working fine in the moment , when I put the cables to the output ,I have a loud "Rattle & Hum ". So I first have to fix my machine and after that I can work with the reel to reel tapes , I think in a few weeks, but I promise you , I will seed it .As you wrote , Roskilde `84was a great gig with ( in my opinion ) one of the best versions of Perfect Kiss and it's a mastertape .too.Much better quality than the bootleg from Roskilde , but when I seed the show I will write more about these things.thanks for all your interest and great comments,booomboom
This master has finally seen the light of day, thanks to booomboom.
He also notes a bit that got left off of the LP boot:
"for the perfect history , you can hear me speaking before track 10, I'm saying a bad german word (Arschloch) that means asshole to my neighbour, because he is crying in my microphones. (this part is only avaiable at my mastertape, 2 seconds)
Source taken from Lars Nellemann CD. Tracks also currently available from NewOrderOnline, which may be where the MP3 set I pulled off of Soulseek come from.
Sounds like it was mastered from LP, like many other versions of early gigs. There's quite a few bootlegs of this set.
_In___A____Lonely___Place_ faded in...
Hooky mutters something that I can't make out at about 0:20. Good screams about 2:30 in, and again at about 3:30. Melodica solo at 4:15
Crazy synth noises appear at the end, and leak over into _Dreams___Never___End_.
First verse almost inaudible...second verse better but they're still having problems with his mic...Hooky doesn't do his soul scream here.
Fan whistles 0:20 into _Truth_. The synth riff is different, it's a two-note riff rather than the usual progression. Melodica riff at different pitch than version on record.
Truth backs into The Him...a particularly chilling version. Barney's vocals are especially clear on this one.
4:37 Bernard, after singing "He pays pennance to the dirt below him", then yells "JUST LIKE YOU!" (thanks to Philip Collins for the correction) 5:27 Keyboard swooping whoosh during break in song 5:55 Hooky hits a bum note
You can hear Hooky calling 1-2-3-4 during the pause in that song.
_Procession_ gets exciting...starts off with an off-kilter Hooky riff.
The lyrics start at 1:42.
At 2:08 BS forgets his lyrics and throws in off-key melodica. At about 3:29, Bernard sings something about "bloody cunts"..."bloody, your prophecies", and screams/drags out "late at night!" and yells out "not so loud!" and "turn my monitor down", and then starts yelping, at which point you can hear his mic being dropped.
_Senses_ has its lyrics declaimed at one point, and Bernard hums along...and then adds additional lyrics not present on studio versions. Thanks to Jan Bollansee for providing a complete version of this song to review.
Bernard spends more than a few seconds afterwards tuning his guitar.
_Denial_ doesn't feature much in the way of its normal lyrics, either.
At 2:20 of Denial, Barney sings about how he "just can't take it no more." (for about 30 seconds). At 4:45, it sounds like he's singing "inside a club!, inside my world!, inside a ____ ____ club club" as the song comes abruptly to a halt.
(or is he singing 'pub' instead of 'club'?)
The final song, _Everythings___Gone___Green_ has a very interesting filter effect that isn't present in later versions...I think it's the same one present in 'Prime 586' though. The song elements are really isolated, and I think the instrumental interplay is effective...and there's a brief tempo speed-up at about 1:35 in. The lyrics, which start at 3:45, are the typical improvisational ones typical for this period. "Down by the boardwalk...". Like the yelled out "Help me, somebody help me" at 6:45.
This version ends up being almost 13 minutes.
N.B. Can you all see the progression from the improvised EGG james ("...down by the boardwalk") to Blue Monday? ("..the beach")...?
Everything's Gone Green-->Prime 586-->Blue Monday
Source is from TJ. Fairly hissy source, but better than nothing at all.
_Chosen___Time_ and _Ceremony_ start things off.
Somebody says something in Finnish.
_Everything's___Gone___Green_
Drums echo to an colossal degree, before Hooky's bass takes over. That's likely due to the venue acoustics.
_In___A___Lonely___Place_
Stereo shift at 0:14 or so. Another one at 2:00. This one otherwise sounds a bit off pitch-wise.
_ICB_ follows. Sound like mic getting bumped at 3:38. Then _Senses_.
_Dreams___Never___End_
Another stereo shift at 0:40.
And then _Denial_.
_Temptation_
The debut, otherwise known as Taboo No. 7.
Several versions.
My first source is a CD from Simon Park. Sounds fairly low-gen (2nd-3rd), some degree of hiss, but the base recording is very good, nearly as good as the Walthamstow gig that follows, with definied instrument separation and not at all boomy. This was also seeded to STG by davemings, as a M/2 (same source), with his version running a bit faster (too fast) than Simon's version. Simon's has more "body", I suspect the difference is in how much NR and cleanup has been done on snotters' source. Subsequent to these, a M/3 (improved copy) was seeded by davemings, also the same source, but by far the clearest of them all.
_Temptation_
The second time this is played, the first being 06 SEP 81 at Kulttuuritalo in Helsinki. As far as I know, this is the only time New Order play this as an instrumental.
At 0:30 or thereabouts, someone near the taper exclaims that this is a new one. The tape garbles a bit at about 2:15.
_The___Him_ follows.
During the break, somebody yells what sounds like "Goodnight, Paul!".
Then a cold edit into _Dreams___Never___End_.
Afterwards, there is a gap of a few seconds, filled with audience members making random utterings, including a male voice saying, "Sounds good" and then a female voice singing. "Don't do...
_Everythings___Gone___Green_ is next followed by _Procession_. There's an edit between that and _Senses_. CD tracksplits not at the start of _Chosen___Time_ but well into the intro.
Right channel cuts out between 1:14-1:20, dunno if it's a problem with my source or the master. Tape garble at 3:28 and another cut-out a few seconds later. These aren't present on the davemings updated copy
They end with _Denial_.
Some punter says, "They did more than one from Movement(?)"
New Order do not interact with the audience at all.
Source is off the master (in .flac format) posted by the taper ("booomboom") on the sharingthegroove.org forums. Sound is outstanding, enough to make any errors in the performance that much audible.
Notes (verbatim from forum)
"taped this show from the first row of the balcony, the quality is amazing for an audience recording. Stephen told me after the show, it was much better to do 40 min of high energy, than to do 120 min of a boring show , and this show from New Order is pure energy. Believe me , it's one of the best shows from 1981 ,and I saw a lot of shows from New Order in this year. Better from the music is the Hamburg Show, but the quality is only very good from the HH. show. But Hamburg has the best versions of "Everything`s gone green " I ever heard."
_Chosen___Time_ has a brief cut 3:10 in.
Opening keyboards to _In___A___Lonely___Place_ are badly off-key.
Somebody hits a bum note at 0:39 of _Dreams___Never___End_.
Hooky sings "make these feelings go away" as the last lines, which isn't something I've regularly heard for that track.
_Truth_ features an echoed whoop.
At the end of _Procession_, the taper says, "Can you get lost, 'cause we're working 'ere...fookin' hell man. What a fucking mess."
_Everythings___Gone___Green_ is 10:43, and has a false start (15 seconds, drums only).
*Very* good guitar work here. One of the best versions of this track that I've heard.
To quote an article (Avant! Issue #1):
"At Bradford in late '81 a dour Peter Hook confronted the boistorous audience with the words, 'If you knew what had happened, you wouldn't be so fucking cheerful." You could have heard a pin drop."
Soundcheck
A minute or so of talking, nothing I can make out. Maybe a reference to Terry (Mason) in there.
_Chosen___Time_
Fadeout/fadein at 1:40 or so. (on another version, this is a cut) Vocals somewhat faint.
_Temptation_ follows.
BS: "One two one two". Then follows a tiny bit of _Denial_, before the tape cuts.
AC1 adds:
"I've just listened to the end of my Bradford 81 tape and there is (technically) a snippet of 'Little Dead', but it's no more than Steve doing a couple of drumrolls, un-accompanied. It doesn't cut out - he just stops playing after a few bars and no one picks it up again. I wouldn't/didn't bother to list it."
From STG posting by 'snotters':
This gig sees New Order as noise terrorists! Just about everything that can go wrong, does go wrong here. The first couple of minutes of Hurt (debuted here at the Ritz) has to do battle with the hapless dj still playing music over the p.a.! Then the "hum" prevailent throughout a lot of the gig starts at the beginning of In A Lonely Place - an annoying hum going through the p.a. which the tape picks up! Barney eventually suggests to the sound guy to turn off ALL the lights - that seems to do the trick.
There's a classic Gillian-related blooper - she plays Senses in the wrong key, for the duration of the entire song!
But in typical New Order style they turn disaster into triumph by playing what is in my opinion one of THE most powerful live performances they ever gave, in Everything's Gone Green. Well, a piece of sonic experimantalism loosely based on Everything's Gone Green, at least. It's so powerful it hurts!! It thunders along relentlessly for 15 minutes like a juggernaut - play this one LOUD and see what I mean!
The quality, despite the p.a. problems, is in my view pretty good - on a par with Hull 82 I would say. Plus this tape has some amusing audience banter (including some booing at the end of the set - surely a first for a New Order recording?!).
And craigie* has made a copy of his master available, which is even better than the Snotters' version.
My notes:
As relayed by 'snotters', you can still here snippets of the PA music over the intro of Hurt, which is debuted here.
(Snotters) Punters at 1:40:
girl: "I'm cutting now[out?]"
guy1: "You're staying..."
guy2: "Get out of the fucking way..."
guy3: "We're all piggybacked..."
guy2: "I know."
Great improvised melodica, it's jazz-like in feel.
Buzzing really starts up between Hurt and In A Lonely Place.
(Snotters)
guy: "[something] match...drum-fest..." guy: "background noise in the f..." There's a brief edit in the tape at 0:29.
The craigie* version has different banter here.
BS: "Maybe it's in the foldback..." Somebody then imitates a radio dispatcher's distorted muttering. Synth fires off randomly, too.
Incredibly enough, Bernard sings through all the din.
(at the end we have this interesting conversation between the band and the
PH: "Jon...(?)...Anything like this is with the lights, this happened on the last one...[muttering, hard-to-decipher]...geez"
(Jon = Jon Hurst?)
BS: "All the hu... the lights can take all the lights out."
BS(?): "I'm real sorry."
PH: "Sorry."
BS: "Try again...it's not going up front."
voice: "No, it's going up front...but there's a bit on the, on this synth as well...maybe the lights are triggering the synth, being real sensitive." [presumably the crew handling the lighting rig]
BS: "I'm real sorry about this."
Punter comments, "Like a fucking science class, this is, innit?"
You can hear this on both versions, louder on the Snotters version, as the person who may have said this may have been very close to the taper. On the craigie* version, this person sounds a few feet away to the left.
Dreams Never End
Still more buzzing.
BS: "Just break the lights, Rob, just forget them." That seems to quiet the buzzing.
(at end)
BS: "Will you turn the back lights up a bit, please."
punter #1 (on both versions, more distant on craigie*): "Wot was that?" punter #2 (satiated): "That'll do".
Truth
More problems. Gillian fires off the intro sequence to Hurt instead, and has to switch back to the right one.
Bernard injects a few extra whoops, the antecedent of what is now a somewhat annoying vocal idiosyncracy of his.
Procession
A bit of guitar tuning before the synth starts in.
punter: "This is the new one".
lyrics: "Hits me where it hurts me, hits me where it hurts me, so hard."
Boing effects, and more tuning.
Senses
As reported, Gillian's synth bit is completely off.
Yet more tuning, and a brief edit between tracks.
Chosen Time
And still more tuning after this one. Punter says "Ceremony", but instead gets the pounding drums of Denial. The synths go out of tune again for a bit.
Unique bass-and-drums ending, very nice!
Everythings Gone Green
This version is almost sixteen minutes long, and has a popping/gurgling bass sequencer effect I've not heard elsewhere.
(Snotters)
punter1: "Thought this is the long one."
punter2: "Eh?"
punter1: [repeating himself] "Thought this is the long one."
Very good punishing, aggressive version.
punter (at 13:54): "I want that...[mumble}"
Most people cheer, but somebody very close to the taper (if not the taper himself) emits a loud "Boo". Not sure if this is heartfelt or not. Music comes over the PA just as the tape fades out on Snotters' version, where craigie*'s version fades out right before that.
Sound quality is very good, though levels vary throughout. Venue mix a bit problematic during the early part of this gig.
New Order come out to a reggae tune.
PH: "I believe we're a little bit late."
Taper adjusts his kit right before the Order start into _The___Him_.
Extreme synths effects at the end of _In___A___Lonely___Place_.
Punter shouts out for _Everythings___Gone___Green_, and wouldn't you know it, he guesses right?
Muffling that affected the first three tracks clears up about a minute into this song.
_Temptation_
Bernard goes into a bit more detail here.
lyrics: "Up down turn around, anywhere you wanna go."
Lots of good improvisational guitar work, one of the best early versions of this song I've heard, helped out by the excellent sound quality.
Cut at the 10:00 mark, probably A/B tape flip.
Audience master copy of JM's tape. There's a different version taped by JJ that has no cut in Senses and a complete version of Denial, and seems to have a bit better fidelity...but the taper pauses after nearly every track, and it's missing the bulk of EGG.
_In___A___Lonely___Place_
Bernard's vocals cut out after the first line. The sound is a bit of a mess here.
_Chosen___Time_
Stephen's kick drum at various points dominates the mix...they sound out of sync here. (JM version)
_Dreams___Never___End_
PH: "One two, can we have some foldback on this? One two, one two."
Somebody can be heard to comment on JM version: "Fucking hum...can't get rid of that."
There's been a bit of hum running througout up to this point, you see.
PH: "One two...one two."
_Dreams___Never___End_
Punter yells "Fuck you!" really loudly. Why?
The Order tune a bit after this one, and things get a whole lot better.
_Hurt_
This is an instrumental version, only the second time they've ever played it. Excellent melodica work.
Squealing tape pause. (JM version)
_ICB_
The best version of this I've ever heard.
_Senses_
Cut at about 3:07...faded out. Second part of the song is 1:51 in length. Unique guitar-ending...and then a bit of Hooky playing the _Ceremony_ bass longer than normal. (JM version, the JJ version is uncut)
_Ceremony_
Barney's singing here is completely and utterly out of tune.
_Denial_
A short version, less than 3 minutes. The JM version is cut. The JJ version is complete, which turns out to be quite a treat here.
_Everythings___Gone___Green_
BS: "Sorry it's not quite what we expected. I don't know it[?]"
People around the taper ask what he said, "I don't know, I heard sorry but I didn't hear anything after that."
Brief cut at 5:38.
Comment at end of JM version, "It was amazing."
Not sure if this is a copy of audience master from JM, as there's a bit more hiss on the source than on the Market St. gig (maybe it was recorded at a quieter level), and it doesn't sound as dynamic, which could be chalked to venue acoustics. It's a better performance, though...except for Dreams Never End, which is pretty awful here.
Some of the songs appear on the 'Isolation' bootleg, the excerpt pertaining to it is the following:
Side 2 is New Order recorded on a bad day on a date I can only guess to be late 1980 or perhaps most probably early 1981. Sound quality is about VG."
Side 2 : Dreams Never End, Denial, Senses, and Ceremony
This is a shitty release. The Joy Division songs have all been on record before. And the New Order songs should not have been on record. Especially Dreams Never End is so bad you will not believe it.
Totally worthles, stay clear.
Writeup
_Hurt_
Third time played, also an instrumental.
Taper misses the intro part. Tape garbles between 1:20 - 1:23.
_Chosen___Time_
Tape squels as it's restarted.
_Procession_ follows.
Somebody close to the taper mutters at about 1:57 or so. Garble at 2:25. Fairly clean edit at end.
_Truth_ and _Senses_ follow.
Squeal edit between these two. At the end of Senses:
BS: "Let's see, I'm not getting any vocal through the foldback, [name]"
Tape squeal edit. Some tuning (tape garbles a bit here), and another squeal edit, missing the very first part of the next number, _Dreams___Never___End_.
A bit of tape trouble starting at 1:45.
Another tape edit between this one and _Denial_.
A bit of talking starting at 2:45.
Two squeal edits before the start of _Ceremony_.
Stop/restart edit, rather than a squeal.
_Temptation_ closes out the set, but cuts after about eight minutes.
lyric: "Three and four make seven."
Otherwise, it has the usual improvisations for this number. Excellent guitar work by Bernard!
A couple of drop outs (like the mic plug was getting pulled out) at about 3:30. Drop out at 6:03 as well. Some more audience chatter can be heard at 6:20.
And this one, at about 7:00 in.
lyric: "Oh it's so bad, Oh it's so bad, Oh, it's just me, oh it's just me! Here today, Here today".
A shame that this cuts out at 8:06!
Sound is clear, if a few generations away from the master and a bit boomy/clipped. Have a better M/2 version from TJ
Right channel cuts out for a bit after _In___A___Lonely___Place_. (original version, not a problem with the TJ version)
A bit of a feedback squall before _Dreams___Never___End_.
_Chosen___Time_ on the TJ version has a phase shift at about 3:36 or so.
_ICB_
On the TJ version, the phase shifts back at 1:07 or so. This happens again at 3:07, and switches back at the end of this track.
Edit between ICB and _Senses_, as well as one between Senses and _Ceremony_.
There's a bit of warbliness on the TJ source on that track at the start (probably due to his source tape). This isn't present on the older version, so it's probably not a defect on the master. There's also a volume drop at somewhat past the 2:00 point, and a brief dropout (3:50 with TJ and 3:44 with the old version) present in both versions.
A tremendous amount of reverb on Bernard's vocals in _Denial_.
_Temptation_ is nine minutes long, and is similar to the version that made it to the FAC71 video. Some interesting guitar work here.
The TJ version has a pop at about 0:57 that the original version doesn't have, and also seems to have more tape stability issues, though better definition that the Nth gen older version.
New Order do not talk to the audience at all, by the way.
Source is a second generation tape from TMK.
_The___Him_
String scraping during the break in this song.
Afterwards, some concertgoer yells, "Turn up the bass!" Others comment, "Mix up the voice" and "...it's a six-string."
_Chosen___Time_
Bernard's vocals are really good here!
If this is the sound of a band falling apart, all bands should fall apart more often.
The group tune up a bit after.
_Ceremony_
Vocals are low in the mix, which is why fans yell, "turn up the vocals", and "check the mic" at the end.
_Truth_
Mic gets bumped at the start.
Snotters says that the drum machine to Truth famously stops for a few beats before someone starts it again, mid-song, which it indeed does, at 2:21.
Ends on Hooky playing a four-note bass melody.
_Senses_
lyric: "..like the ocean...see the angels above me..."
_Everythings___Gone___Green_
A bit of a different intro, lots of syncopated synth here.
_Dreams___Never___End_ follows.
_Denial_
The vocals have been turned up by this point.
_Hurt_
An instrumental version (4th time it is played) wraps up the set. The band have not spoken one word to the audience.
Source: MP3s pulled from Soulseek, with heavy noise reduction applied.
_Ceremony_
At 1:10, Hooky addresses the crowd, tellim them to move back. Can't make out exact wording. There's a skip about 4:00 in.
_Dreams___Never___End_
Skip about 8 seconds in (more likely), or (less likely) Hooky blows the bass line. Bernard says something about "...a bit of nostalga for punk..."
_The___Him_
Skip at 1:10
Barney plays guitar during the break where all instruments pause.
_Truth_
The intro to this one's a bit different than normal.
There's an interpolation in the first verse.
At about 2:30, I swear I hear Bernard singing about "such a strange pair of legs".
An unusually good version of _ICB_.
_Chosen___Time_
At about 2:10 Bernard screams "YOU GOT A FRIEND..."
We go up in down
We go in sync
We (can't make out rest of the line)
Makes me sick
_Denial_
Intro (before vocals) is 1:35 in length.
Sounds 19 Nov 81
Live Review by Tim Sommer
(includes photo)
http://www.new-order.net/terminal1.demon.co.uk/NewMM12-81live.htm
NOTES
Tim Sommer later became an MTV VJ (Postmodern MTV in the late 80s) and was the bassist in Hugo Largo. I remember watching an episode where he highly complimented the band's early sound, as you will see when you read the article. He was not so sanguine as to New Order's later (synthesised) direction.
Meanwhile, here's another review of the same gig. I'm amazed I haven't transcribed this, as it is readily available.
Date: Tue Mar 20 12:44:16 1990
From: CAR-RT SORT
Subject: early no gig review...
Hi Again!
I was rummaging through some trash I've collected over the years and came across some copies of some underground magazines from New York circa 1980-1982. Since the Taras Shevchenko (sp?) video has been mentioned a bit lately I thought I'd type in a review from that gig. The magazine was called "Non LP B Side". I've collected almost every issue published. It started out free and ended up costing 75 cents. If anyone has any copies which they're tired of, mail me, maybe we can work out a trade! Ed
NEW ORDER Nov. 19, 1981
Walking down St. Mark's familiar path, droplets pissing down, droves of dark overcoated souls seemed drawn to some unknown destination. What could have been driving these purposeful people in this strange almost mystic way? NEW ORDER UKRAINIAN HALL THURSDAY NIGHT. What were we looking for? The answer to some rhetorical question, a message from the dead, or maybe just a good gig. I'd seen them before, a disgruntled gloomy lot, and I felt an intruder to their private misery, but this was different. An unfamiliar venue, the Ukraine seldom sees conventional "rock" gigs, and will surely not see another like this one. Due to Chase Parks' untimely closing Factory Records (Michael Shamburg) and Ruth Polski were forced to find an alternate venue for New Order. At the last moment they brought in full lighting, video and a sound system capable of making a 24 track recording of the event. The sound was wonderful in light of the haste, with minimal feed-back and sputtering, the lighting was eerie and yellowish. The D.J. set the atmosphere nicely by kindly omitting all those songs we are conditioned to hearing in clubs, no one danced, the air was full of anticipation.
Ike Yard, a recent Factory signing was first up. I'm afraid they are much better on record, as they left a few unprofessionally long gaps between songs, and seemed to have some difficulties. They were, however, interesting, and I'm sure they'll be better after live practice. Finally New Order took the stage and all stretched to see their faces. Most striking was Gillian Gilbert, with her white face and burgundy hair. She spent most of the evening crouched over her synthesizer or intently watching the fingerboard of her guitar. It seems that New Order's idea of stage presence is none at all. It is the music that is important, not the posture. Bernard Albrecht did most of the vocals, and provided the melodies with his careful guitar. He was as intense as ever, seeming ill at ease and earnest at once.
The set was perfect, sublime, uplifting. It is hard to remember which songs came when, though I do remember, "Procession" blending into "Ceremony" was beautiful. They did a lot of material from the new album MOVEMENTS [sic]. "Dreams Never End", sung by Peter Hook was especially moving. The last song, and toure de force was definitely "Temptation", which will probably be the next single. Bernard was left singing and staring Heaven-ward, hopefully. This was not the New Order I remembered, there was no gloom. They did not seem to conjure Ian's ghost. This New Order was a complete unit with powerful ideas and music of their own.
The show left me jubilant, joyful, like a weight removed from my shoulder. New Order will mourn no more. They have come to grips with the present and the music will [win] out. I have, the answer to my question; Life goes on.
Dec Hickey's fabulous 'From Heaven To Heaven' quotes the following setlist for this show:
The Him
Dreams Never End
Procession
Truth
Senses
Chosen Time
Denial
Ceremony
IALP
There's a high pitched whine throughout on my source.
Probably one of the poorest-quality I have. Luckily, an upgrade surfaced that has none of the defects detailed below
_In___A___Lonely___Place_
Feedback during the first bit.
_Dreams___Never___End_
Somebody calls out "Warsaw" beforehand.
_Chosen___Time_
Bernard's vocals are higher in pitch at the start, and there's also a bit of feedback here.
_ICB_
A bit of a strange version, with a very spare feel, and an insistent drum pattern.
_Senses_
Band tune up. Same guy calls for Warsaw again. Sound on this one is extremely loud, distorting on the tape. Also some glitches with the way this plays back on CD.
_Denial_ is similarly distorted, as well as the rest of the songs here.
Short version of _Everythings___Gone___Green_.
_Hurt_ follows. Sounds like an instrumental.
Segues into _Temptation_, performed in the same way as on other US '81 gigs.