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New Order Net |
Tape courtesy of Snotters. As he notes, it sounds like about 40 people were there.
announcer: "Okay, punters, if you can put your hands on stage and welcome on stage, New Order. Thank you."
ICB
Instrumental version. Second time for this one.
BS: "A little more snare though the foldback, please."
In_A__Lonely___Place_
Solid version, not much of note.
Senses
Remarkable intro bass synth sound, not unlike a growling motor.
Mesh
Different arrangement, with the extended drum and single bass note, as well as Bernard's funky guitar work at the 1:30 point. Like it quite a bit!
I really wish a soundboard version of this song would surface so we can transcribe the lyrics.
Some audience chatter between tracks.
Dreams__Never___End_
(at the end)
BS: "The guitar through the foldback..."
BS: "Yep...that's it."
Cries__And___Whispers_
Another good intro.
A bit of audience chatter at the end.
Truth
Slightly different drum pattern than what appeared later. Mic gets bumped a couple of times at around the 3:30 point.
The__Him_
The second time this is played. The lyrics are nearly fully formed, there may be a few lyrical variations, but nothing stands out. Though Gillian's synth part is simpler than it would become.
Also has the break where the song stops and starts again.
Some tape tracking issues (increased hiss) shortly before 2:00, and at around the 4:00 mark.
Ceremony
Has initial bass riff, than a pause, and then it comes in a rush. Bernard's guitar sound is a bit different, I guess he hadn't picked up his Ceremony guitar at this point.
A very uplifting version.
Sound on long-circulating version is decent, but probably not low-gen.
In March 2007, Duncan seeded his upgraded master clone to DIME. And if you can believe it, there's another master clone in existence which GaoBest received from a friend of the band.
BS: "Hi."
Bernard makes some noises before Procession.
Duncan's version fades in, so this is not heard on his version.
A fairly involved guitar solo here.
At about 1:05 somebody sounds like they're saying 'sorry'.
Lady can be heard giggling a bit on some of the audience versions. Duncan's version features the following conversation.
punter: "Is that a new one or a new one"
lady: "An old one"
taper (I think): "Oh, fucking good then."
punter: "I only know a few, c'mon."
Brief pause on the GaoBest version.
Dreams__Never___End_
GaoBest version gets inadvertently paused during the intro.
BS: "Can I have some guitar through the foldback, please?" [a few more words muttered which I can't make out]
Hooky calls for "guitar" at 1:45.
More conversion on the Duncan version, with the girl saying "I've never really been into Joy Division."
Truth
Bit of a slow intro there.
Taper says "Just move this back a little bit."
Mesh
Hooky does his usual bit. 1:21, 1:26, 1:28-1:31, and 1:51-1:55 have dropouts, at least on my copy. But not on Duncan's.
BS: "We'd like to apologize for the feedback... What was I thinking? Is it all right?"
The__Him_
Somebody yells out "Get it right" at the start.
Sound starts garbling up between 1:20-1:30 on my old copy, but not on Duncan's.
Very harsh guitars suggesting the mix was a bit of a problem.
The band tune up between this song and the next.
Cries__And___Whispers_
Bernard sings this.
lyric: "Once, out of reach, we never speak, we never see"
Some person (higher pitched reedy male voice) says something which I can't make out.
BS: "What?"
Same person: "You seem a little bit down to me. [couple more words I can't make out]" Could also be "of that one" instead of "a bit down", or something else entirely, don't know.
Ceremony
BS: "Anybody got anything to say? Or are you just going to [can't make out the rest]..."
The set closes off with a nice, boingy Senses.
Recording posted to DIME by Duncan in March 2007.
The opening track is Ceremony.
PH: "Turn the foldback...on the wedges."
BS: "Turn the guitar up through the foldback as its feeding back."
Mesh
Great guitar riffing here, though it overwhelms the song near the end.
Truth
BS: "Well, well, well. We're not going to play any Joy Division songs. What you'd do an encore for."
BS: "This one's called Truth, though."
The fans comment about this pronouncement.
The melodica and synth combo are piercingly, hauntingly beautiful here.
The__Him_ follows.
In_A__Lonely___Place_
Great-sounding growling synth at the start.
voice: "There's a little bit of distortion on the left hand side of the keyboard."
BS: "The left hand side of the PA has blown up, actually."
voice: "Oh, the PA...my God."
Dreams__Never___End_ follows.
Cries__And___Whispers_
There's feedback through the first verse.
BS: "Sorry about the silent party",
Neil O'Connor (who recorded the show) noted Bernard's wry comment, and that it was said, "as if to have a little dig at the crowd who were pretty much stood montionless, only offering reserved applause in-between songs.
Senses
voice: "Just like the Cure, that one...
BS: "Listen to that bass, woo. Electric drums, that."
Soundcheck
The__Him_
BS: (2:05) "I need vocals [thru the] foldback."
Senses
Lots of boingy sound effects
PH: "One two. Give me this...one two, one two. Ho-kay, now. One two."
BS: "Okay, one...let's just re... that. One two."
The guitar riff to "Sweet Jane".
Bernard and Hooky one-two.
Truth
You take those cymbals down a little bit in the foldback. One two."
Hooky plays the bassline of Dead Souls through the drum machine line, really cool...before reverting back to the normal bassline of the song.
BS: (1:48) "One two"
Hooky cries out for "Jerry" and the song comes to a close, and someone says "this is the last song of..." and something about shouting.
BS: "That's all right, apart from that."
PH: "One two"
Only have one of the tracks (in MP3 form). Sound is downright dodgy. The whole thing has since shown up, with sound still dodgy.
TJ had the following description (based on 'An Ideal For Living'):
"Bombers Over Vienna opened, and Positive Noise were on second.
A terrible sounding gig, both at the gig and on recording, Bernard complained throughout about the PA system. They aborted Dreams Never End halfway through and tried it again after a Bernard tantrum, and he introduced Cries and Whispers as Atmosphere, but then added "we were gonna do that but because of the shit PA we can't". An encore of Ceremony topped proceedings. One of the worst sounding NO tapes there is!"
In_A__Lonely___Place_
Hooky "one, twos" right before his vocal turn and through the cheering for the song they had just played, in preperation for the next song, Dreams__Never___End_. Or at least the first run-through, which peters about after about two minutes.
They then start over, and this time make it through.
BS: "For fuck sake, get this fucking [something] straight onto that stupid [something else] now."
Truth
About 30 seconds in...
BS: "Oh, we got a drum machine now."
Mesh follows...a very good rendition, actually.
Procession
Bernard cries out "What?" at about 0:52 in.
Tape fades out at this point.
ICB
BS: "...[something], man(?)"
The__Him_
Bernard's vocals end up much louder than the music, probably at the point the PA starts to give out.
Cries__And___Whispers_
BS: "Still like fucking shit sound...who was that?"
(As synths start up)
BS: "It's called Atmosphere..." (huge cheering) "Nononononono, sorry, no it's not. We're gonna do that before, but because of the shit PA we can't. Requires a [sounds like 'harsh military'] sound'.
Mark Refoy suggests he's talking about the bad sound.
Fades out.
Senses
Sounds like a different recording, more clear.
BS: "Sorry about the sound... [couple more words hard to make out]"
The bass drum here is especially loud.
BS: "Listen to that bass drum. Whoo! Electric drums, that."
Terrific guitar riffing here.
The track fades out, but not before a boost in the s
Ceremony
Some noodling with the amps.
BS: (hard to make out) "Sorry, changing out...interested in buying a drum? Well, look man, anyway...the enthusiasm...[word]...up"
Source is from kered5's master. Better than what you would expect from a dictation-type tape recorder. Also have a source from CW, recorded with a Sony TCS-300, featuring better sound, and more audiene chatter.
In_A__Lonely___Place_ is first, followed by Dreams__Never___End_.
At 3:00 on the CW tape, a girl yelps. There's quite a bit of audience chatter before DNE (somebody mentions Joy Division at one point), and feedback at 1:13 or so.
The end of DNE features somebody cackling, and a tiny bit of tuning.
ICB
Drumbeats sound like somebody stamping their feet on the floor.
BS: "There's no sequencer in the foldback."
Sequencer? 1981? Yup, that's what he says.
A tiny bit of guitar fiddling before the start of Truth.
A hiccup sound at the end. Barney bashes out some chords.
Procession follows, and then The__Him_.
More tuning and a "boing!" synth effect preceding Senses, that can also be heard during the song's intro.
Edit between Senses and Ceremony (CW tape)
(on the kered5 tape)
And yet more tuning before Ceremony. One fan says something about it being the new single. There appears to be some bleed-through at the 2:10 point. There's also some talking from 3:10 through the next minute...whoever it is sounds perhaps upset at the brevity of the set?
Sounds 21 Feb 81
Live Review by Chris Burkham
(includes photo)
http://www.new-order.net/terminal1.demon.co.uk/NewSounds2-81live.htm
NOTES
Article identifies Gillian as Steve Morris' girlfriend. They've been together for a very long time, as this was written early 1981.
Definitely written by somebody sympathetic to their "cause".
Soundcheck tracks include instrumental Joy Division numbers like "Glass" and "Digital".
I remember that the AIFL tome mentioned that the PA was quadrophonic, which was said to be an experiment that failed.
The band starts off with In_A__Lonely___Place_.
Some chatter after...weird metallic plucking afterwards.
Unusual start to Dreams__Never___End_ with guitar playing a full minute and a half before Hooky's bass comes in.
Some more chatter and tittering, as there's another longish-break between tracks, which Stephen fills with drum fills.
ICB
Intro sounds a bit like Senses here.
Truth
Distinctive feature is a female punter commenting about the sound.
Procession
Weird guitar+keyboard intro.
BS: "...more guitar through the foldback...[can't make out rest due to the reverb]"
The__Him_
The sound mix seems to do this one good. Hooky mutters something at about 2:25. Folks clap at 4:15, not knowing that the silence there wasn't the end of the song.
Senses
I love the spring-type sounds at the start. Stereo shift at about 3:05.
Ceremony finishes out the set.
To quote from Mark Johnson:
"To the massive-but-short-lived cheers of the audience Bernard announced that the eighth song would be "Atmosphere", but he hastened to add 'We were going to do that, but because of the shit P.A., we can't.
Master recording courtesy of Duncan.
This is one where the band just play, there's very little interaction that you can hear here.
Denial
We have what sounds like bleed-through on the tape or somebody left Section 25 on stage.
This is followed by In_A__Lonely___Place_ and Dreams__Never___End.
A bit of an odd version, very guitar-heavy and Hooky doesn't sing "soul" at the end of the second verse.
Procession follows.
Truth
Bernard strums his guitar, VU-like, during the intro, which really gets going with Hooky's driving bass, interrupted by a random feedback squall.
ICB then follows.
Senses
The band tune up and take a small break to plug in guitars a bit between this and the final track Ceremony.
Soundcheck
Consists of three tracks.
Doubts__Even___Here_
Initially titled, 'Tiny Tim', this is the first instrumental run through of this track. Very arresting, yet another case of the first time being the best.
Denial
At the time, this was known as 'Little Dead'.
Truth
This is just 'Truth'.
Quality of my version is decent. A better version from a different source tape (copy from the master) has recently surfaced.
New Order open the set with Ceremony.
Then comes Dreams__Never___End_ with audience members asking and answering what song this is. Hooky's vocals are fairly clear in this one, though the opening bass riff stumbles a bit. They then roll into In_A__Lonely___Place_.
Some audience chatter during the intro of Truth, to the effect that the track they were playing hadn't been released yet, but I'm not completely certain that's in fact what was said.
Bernard tunes his guitar a bit before ICB.
The__Him_ follows. Rough edit before Procession.
(afterwards)
BS: "a bit more guitar through the monitor would be lovely... more guitar."
Denial concludes the set. Second time it's ever played. It nearly sounds hopeful, and is quite a good version that has the crowd crying out for more, which they of course do not get.
Most commonly heard as part of "The Dream" bootleg.
Looks like this is the 27 Mar 81 Trinity Hall Bristol England gig. Sounded like a very rowdy crowd, too bad my high-quality headphones blew out, so I'm having to use external speakers to play the music through, which makes transcribing between-song patter a bit harder.
This happens to be documented at
http://slashmc.rice.edu/ceremony/neworder/no_disc/noboots.html#dream
(except that the second "Senses" is from the gig, not the first...)
Support was Tunnelvision.
Bass in Ceremony during the bridge is badly out of tune.
Near the end of the song Bernard says "less guitar in the foldback."
Procession
BS: "Less guitar in the foldback."
Some punter yells "dross".
BS: "What?"
Punter yells "dross" again.
BS: "Come up here and aay that, cuntface. I cannot see through here. Stand up here, don't be afraid."
Another punter comments, "Talking doesn't swear".
(as Bernard is now able to survey the crowd)
BS: "You've got blonde hair!"
This episode is recounted in Mark Johnson's "An Ideal For A Living" book.
On one version, the taper or someone close to him talks (what he says I can't make out) as Bernard sings "It's a problem, you know".
Dreams__Never___End_
Same punter as before repats his shout of "dross" .
BS: "You're fucking moving to the front, right, you fuck(?)."
In_A__Lonely___Place_
Some audience chatter at the start of this.
Truth
BS: "This one...to foldback, foldback".
Taper or someone near him cries "hey".
The__Him_
You can hear BS yelling twice for "a little bit more guitar"...and "a little more guitar though the foldback".
Person near taper comments, "That was magic."
Senses follows.
More taper comments.
Denial closes out the set.
Soundcheck
There are multiple separate sources. Their tracklists are as follows:
The "Denial" here is taken from 1981-04-10 Cedar Club B'ham and not this gig!
They are about eqivalent in quality.
Hard to make out the speaking in the first part.
Bernard says something about the foldback.
PH: "One two, one two...that's all right, Ozzie. One two. Drum machine. Getting old, right?"
voice (perhaps Ozzie): "We're getting old..."
PH: "Drum machine, Barney."
ICB (vocal version) follows.
Hooky says something about the guitar to Ozzie about midway through.
Some comments about the wedgies afterwards.
Punter says "five quid"...
Then Hooky plays the bassline of what sounds like Komakino but is really Senses, as the riffs are similar, and it really illustrates the link between the two songs. At 2:09, Bernard cries out, "more guitar."...long fadeout during the middle of the track.
Senses
(after)
BS: "Yeah, the guitar was right at the end there, if...if you keep the foldback level on the guitar like that was at the end, than that's alright."
Someone cries out for Hooky...Steve, Gillian.
Ozzie: "Yeah, turn it down a bit..."
BS: "Yeah...fuckin'...Can you give us as much top on the vocals as possible, Ozzie?"
Ozzie: "As much top as possible?"
BS: "Without feeding back."
Ozzie: "Yeah, well, the problem...feeding now..."
BS: "What?"
Ozzie: "We'll do that now...[mutter]
BS: "Okay."
voice: "Turn the foldback down...wait, WAIT!"
PH(?) (off-mic): "You don't get that many of 'em..."
The first source is a tape from the archives, which only contain the listed tracks, omitting Dreams Never End and Denial, at least according to Waterrat.
I've since received a much more clear version, with all of the tracks present. It may be from a second source.
Sound is hissy but is fairly listenable, being a bit bass-heavy. The hissiness may have been due to the recorder.
BS: "Don't cheer, Won't...after...visit..." (can't make out)
(the second source starts after this point)
Doubts__Even___Here_
The debut of this song, first of eight times New Order perform this song. (they had stopped playing it by June 1981) Sung by Hooky. Great version, especially like the synth effects at the start.
Break at 0:51 on second source, the first being complete.
Chosen__Time_
Debut of this song as well! Bernard yells out "I'll never know!". Features some soloing not heard in the album or later live versions.
There's an edit between the prior song and Truth (likely the missing Dreams Never End).
Dreams__Never___End_
Bit of a false start with the opening bass riff.
Truth follows.
The next song is In_A__Lonely___Place_.
Mark Johnson says that, "Bernard forgot the lyrics of IALP. He was singing along in the usual way, then he got to one passage and all that came from his mouth was a rather daft noise for the rest of the line. Finally, Peter came in and started singing to save him."
This is followed by Procession, and then Senses, which on my original tape is cut...
Last song is Denial. Garbles at 2:00 for about 20s. Mic bump at 4:00.
Taken from B. Vick archives, on a CH-sourced tape, whose master sounds fairly good. Too bad this is an Nth generation copy.
Another recording from Duncan has recently surfaced.
Doubts__Even___Here_
Second performance of this song.
punter: "That was with the same voice..." (I think)
Nearly three minutes until Hooky's vocal, they may have been having mic problems of some sort. Some audience/stage interaction which I have to listen to closer.
Mic bump and a feedback squall at the end.
Ceremony
Some audience chatter at the end of this.
punter: "The last days, talked to him. And Nelson. And David."
another: "What were they playing?"
punter: "Who wants to get that?"
third: "Play one you know."
Dreams__Never___End_
Hooky completely flubs the intro, and has to start again.
PH: "Can I get...with the foldback, please?"
BS: "More foldback for me."
The__Him_
Very good version, long feedback squall near the end, right before Barney sings, "so tired."
Truth
The drum machine starts out really fast, but is slowed down to the proper pitch after the first measure.
More audience comments near the end.
Tape break (squeegie-like, no better way of describing the sound the old recorders would make) between this and the next track.
A slight bit of soundchecking.
Chosen__Time_
Second performance of this number.
Bernard's vocals in the middle are pretty ropey. Sounds like they speed up during the bridge.
Procession
BS: "Can I get some more foldback, Ozzie? More foldback."
Bernard tunes up at the end of this. A couple of boing noises (synth tune-up?) can be heard as well.
Senses follows.
Punter and friend chat during the intro of Denial.
Weird sound during the "terrifies me" line...and the same sound later on during the "I tried so hard line"...sounds a bit like static.
Hair-raising "inside of me" shouts.
Soundcheck
Denial
(afterwards)
Ozzy: "Steve - You okay with that - can you hear it?" (The last part of the sentence being shortened to "Can y'ear it?")
My version (which was what was identified as being from Reading) cuts out at this point.
SM: "Yeah. (Pause) It's alright"
Ozzy: (after a pause) "How about you Barney? Are you okay?" (The word 'about' is muffled by a cymbal noise)
BS: "Can you give us a bit more top on the vocals in the foldback?"
Ozzy: "Yeah we'll try that....(rest is too quiet to hear)"
The__Him_ follows. The WR listing has it reversed in "real time".
Doubts__Even___Here_ opens the set, the last time it would ever do so.
Chosen__Time_
Stereo shift at 3:05 on TJ version.
Somebody barks right before the start of Dreams__Never___End_.
ICB
During the intro, Bernard says something about turning the syndrum up.
At 2:42, there's a ripping sound.
Senses follows, as does Denial and Procession.
Ceremony
The TJ version is cut at about the 4:00 mark. An alternate version from ST is complete.
Last tape of the Scotland mini-tour, supported by The Visitors.
My version is a fairly poor audience tape.
Some audience chatter after the opener, Ceremony, Bernard appears to apologize for something, I can't make out what.
It could be at this point he says "this is God speaking, this is your death speaking". (unverified)
The__Him_ follows, and then the fourth of the eight performances of Doubts__Even___Here_.
Truth
PH: "We're..." [five words, can't make out rest]"
At end...
PH: "Move(?) back ...because the the foldback..."
Bernard utters a word.
Senses
Some woman calls out "Mark" or somesuch a few times.
Dreams__Never___End_
Bass intro sounds a bit strange, like Hooky's not playing it on the six-string.
Chosen__Time_ follows.
The intro to Denial is a bit muffed.
Both this and In_A__Lonely___Place_ have Bernard screeching.
Near the end Bernard starts to passionatly scream out lyrics, but due to the quality of the source tape I can't make anything out.
Fairly hissy (though not muddy) sounding tape, but still fairly listenable. A Duncan recording with a soundcheck take of "Ceremony" has since shown up.
These tracks are prefaced on my source tape with versions of Procession and Dreams Never End (cuts after less than a minute) that are taken from an unknown gig, most likely either Chorley (03 Jan 81) or Plato's Ballroom, Liverpool (14 Jan 81) but could be any number of other dates if Procession wasn't the opener.
It's now believed that the soundcheck tracks (Denial and Senses) attributed to this gig are actually taken from Cedar Club Birmingham 1981-04-10 and Trinity Hall Bristol 1981-03-27 respectively. However, it does appear that there is a legit recording of Ceremony being soundchecked.
And it seems there's at least two versions as Whiskybob on DIME has put up one that doesn't have all the cuts the first version does.
The__Him_
The original version joins this track in progress (first part of the song is cut), but the newer version is complete.
There's a fair amount of talking through the intro of next song, Chosen__Time_.
Ends in low-pitched filter sweeps.
Dreams__Never___End_
At the end, a punter says, "Right, really nice...".
Truth
lyric: "Some people look down on me, I hope they're disgusted with what they see."
On the old version, the end of the song is cut, but is complete on the newer source.
Procession
At one point, Bernard sings "I don't know" during the "Destruction... devotion, it's all the same to me." bit.
Senses
Features a very prominent guitar solo bit.
A tape cut (old version, new one has no cut), and then New Order tunes up with Barney ranting about something...for over a minute before the start of the next tune, Ceremony.
BS: "Hey, you'll just have to wait while we tune up...[new version has a cut here] something to think about for all you futurists... especially the ones with ... coats(?) [here he makes really weird vocal noises]... craft. If you don't understand that, you're not a Futurist."
Mark Johnson says that the point of this was to attack those who had identified or labelled the group as aligned with Futurism.
Out of the blue, Bernard SCREAMS "I'll break them down"...
New Order segue right into In_A__Lonely___Place_.
(about 4 minutes in)
BS: "Bass Drum...[name]...turn the bass drums back up...just turn (up) the bass...everyone, New Order is sick of the stories...[something] I want everyone to be sick...just sick of the way...you just don't understand...[something] nuclear(?)...[something] nature...you should be sick...[something] acid...and then he goes completely unhinged on the Futurists, "you're just shit...you're just dirt, you're just scum, you're just filth, you're just sick...scum...dirt...sick-filled scum-filled, you... you're shit, you're shit, you're shit...[other mutterings] scoot back, you little shit" etc. The song comes to a close.
There's another edit in the tape. Apparently Section 25 come on and performs a long jam with New Order...sounding a bit like Cries__And___Whispers_, but has Larry Cassidy (I think) on vocals, who sings a few lyrics. There's a small break for applause, and then the music starts up again, with the keyboards serving to define the melody, and then has a drum-only section, and some more Cassidy vocals before the tape cuts out.
Tape courtesy of 'nof586'.
Instrumental
This to me sounds like a reworking of Mesh, but incorporating elements of 'Sister Ray', especially with respect to the drumming. Excellent stuff.
Procession
A segue from the last track.
Bernard screeches after one of the verses.
The band tune up after the end, doing it for well over 30 seconds.
Ceremony is played next.
Doubts__Even___Here_
Played only two more times afterwards. None of these versions feature Gillian's part. Ends with drums.
Truth
Bernard wanders from the script at the 1:48 point, when he sings "Seems so glad they destruct" (rather than "to be here")
Dreams__Never___End_
Stellar-sounding guitar from Mr. Sumner.
ICB
Again, great guitar work from Bernard.
Break in tape between this and Senses.
Then Denial, followed by another brief break.
The concert ends with In_A__Lonely___Place_ which in and of itself is unusual, with an rendition to match.
Bernard says something at 1:40 I can't make out.
"I'm warm like a debt..." as he stumbles over the lyric shortly before the 3:00 point.
Shortly before 4:00: "Turn the microphone down...turn the bass drum up."
Followed by a few yelps.
Bernard than starts talking, which I can't make out.
Only two tracks that appear to be extant are from "A Factory Complication".
Everythings__Gone___Green_
The debut for this song.
The lyrics are much unlike any version I've ever heard, but are too low in the mix to be able to properly decipher.
Truth
Nothing really special to note.
The__Him_ ends with a neat guitar coda.
The melodica solo on Truth is a bit uneven.
Barney almost utters something at the end of Chosen__Time_, sounds like "Hello".
Everythings__Gone___Green_ here is over ten minutes.
Here's a transcription...the wording in certain places is very uncertain.
Hearing the love from above
And shooting it up ... the world[?]
Position[?] it all above
Destruction brought up below
By the boardwalk
By the boardwalk
Down by the boardwalk
Down by the boardwalk
Where all you people go
They destroy you sa...
Down by the boardwalk
Where people go...
Down by the boardwalk x5
Woo woo woo woo
(with syncopated mouth drum sounds]
Down by the boardwalk!
Down by...
One two three turn around
All you people upside down
One two three
One three four
Everybody hit the floor
One two three four
Everybody hit the floor
Five six seven eight
Everybody's feeling great
Woo!
By the boardwalk
Where all the hip people go
By the boardwalk
You people are so slow!
I'm waiting from up above...x3
I'm in love x4
(melody of 'I feel love' by Donna Sunner
I'm in love
I'm in love x4
I'm in love x4
Wooooo...
[Bernard yelps]
Down by the boardwalk...
In five seconds
You'll receive your help from below
Where nice people don't like you go...
Wooooooo...woohoowhoohoo
Wooooooo...woohoowhoohoo
[More yelping]
I have two seperate MP3 versions of this (both 128k CBR), one from the audio anthologies, the other downloaded from Soulseek. This review is based off of the Soulseek collection, I haven't done an A/B comparison, but I suspect the Soulseek version has better SQ. Both version seem to have the same whooshing effect caused by excessive noise reduction.
Since picked up a lossless copy that is definitely the same source as the Soulseek MP3s, but somewhat better sound.
Denial
BS: "Ed, drums through the foldback."
Dropout on right channel for a few seconds at about 0:36-0:44.
BS: (lyric)"...stain on my windows." More bass!
He then yells "Outside me!"
The__Him_
BS: Screams out "Shut up!" during the break in the song.
Doubts__Even___Here_
The last time New Order ever play this one.
The end of Senses has some weird repeated noise.
Not much more than this to report, they basically just play the songs with little audible crowd interaction.
Mark Johnson says that the PA crew was affiliated with 10CC and that New Order's short set was directed at how they were bragging that their band could play for 2 1/2 hours compared to New Order's 45 minutes.
http://www.angelfire.com/ga/zza77/temp/oslo.htm has a detailed review of this gig.
This performance exists in a number of formats.
One of the performances on the fabled 'Dreams Never End' 3xLP bootleg. Includes the complete perfornamce.
Audio from New Order Anthology Volume 5, with "Senses" mislabelled as "Chosen Time".
Also missing some tracks ("Truth", "IALP")
The rarest is a video, shot in near black-and-white with flickering due to it being an early PAL to NTSC mastering job. Definitely not a pro shot, way too many shock jerk zoom in and outs. Sound is distorted in the bass rumble direction, and is in mono, and may have been taken from a copy of a bootleg, as there is crackling, though the sound seems not to have been re-EQ'ed, as it now appears to have been in my copy of the 'Dreams Never End' bootleg. Video quality is murky, to say the least (on par with FACT37). Bernard has a strange far away stare, probably chemically induced. More closeups of Steve Morris than normally seen in these sorts of things.
Video starts with Dreams__Never___End_ (the first two songs apparently no having been filmed). Gillian is initially barely present.
The__Him_
Would this be the first recorded instance of the "woo"?
The Him: "Some days you waste your life away...whoo!"
Ceremony, Truth, and ICB follow, the latter featuring excellent guitar interplay. Volume suddenly rises for a second at the 4:47 point.
Tremendous bass feedback that starts between Senses and Procession... it drowns out much of the latter song.
Intense version of Denial. IALP has more bass rumbling, and an improv sequence near the end.
Despite press propaganda, New Order did play encores in the early days. The whistling and cheering is nearly deafening as the bad eventually make it back on for Everything's__Gone___Green_, and more headache-inducing zooming.
Featured is Ian's Vox guitar, which Bernard plays on for the duration of the song. About midway during the song, there's an edit and the camera angle changes. Near the end of the song, Bernard appears to be chatting to Gillian for a bit, then he straps his guitar and returns to what he was doing. Even with the edit, the song is nearly 9 minutes long.
Some more information about the master, from "booomboom" in the sharingthegroove.org forums:
Originally posted by snotters:
Fantastic! Can't wait - Roskilde 84 is a great gig too. Brilliant versions of Sunrise and Perfect Kiss. But then most of the 84 gigs were great (pre-Lowlife).
Booom, did you digitise Berlin 81 at all?
[His reply, unedited]:
No,and I have a little problem with that. The original was taped by a Uher reel to reel ,I have the reel to reel tape , but my reel to reel machine ( I hope , that's the right word ) is not working fine in the moment , when I put the cables to the output ,I have a loud "Rattle & Hum ". So I first have to fix my machine and after that I can work with the reel to reel tapes , I think in a few weeks, but I promise you , I will seed it .As you wrote , Roskilde `84was a great gig with ( in my opinion ) one of the best versions of Perfect Kiss and it's a mastertape .too.Much better quality than the bootleg from Roskilde , but when I seed the show I will write more about these things.thanks for all your interest and great comments,booomboom
This master has finally seen the light of day, thanks to booomboom.
He also notes a bit that got left off of the LP boot:
"for the perfect history , you can hear me speaking before track 10, I'm saying a bad german word (Arschloch) that means asshole to my neighbour, because he is crying in my microphones. (this part is only avaiable at my mastertape, 2 seconds)
Source taken from Lars Nellemann CD. Tracks also currently available from NewOrderOnline, which may be where the MP3 set I pulled off of Soulseek come from.
Sounds like it was mastered from LP, like many other versions of early gigs. There's quite a few bootlegs of this set.
In_A___Lonely___Place_ faded in...
Hooky mutters something that I can't make out at about 0:20. Good screams about 2:30 in, and again at about 3:30. Melodica solo at 4:15
Crazy synth noises appear at the end, and leak over into Dreams__Never___End_.
First verse almost inaudible...second verse better but they're still having problems with his mic...Hooky doesn't do his soul scream here.
Fan whistles 0:20 into Truth. The synth riff is different, it's a two-note riff rather than the usual progression. Melodica riff at different pitch than version on record.
Truth backs into The Him...a particularly chilling version. Barney's vocals are especially clear on this one.
4:37 Bernard, after singing "He pays pennance to the dirt below him", then yells "JUST LIKE YOU!" (thanks to Philip Collins for the correction) 5:27 Keyboard swooping whoosh during break in song 5:55 Hooky hits a bum note
You can hear Hooky calling 1-2-3-4 during the pause in that song.
Procession gets exciting...starts off with an off-kilter Hooky riff.
The lyrics start at 1:42.
At 2:08 BS forgets his lyrics and throws in off-key melodica. At about 3:29, Bernard sings something about "bloody cunts"..."bloody, your prophecies", and screams/drags out "late at night!" and yells out "not so loud!" and "turn my monitor down", and then starts yelping, at which point you can hear his mic being dropped.
Senses has its lyrics declaimed at one point, and Bernard hums along...and then adds additional lyrics not present on studio versions. Thanks to Jan Bollansee for providing a complete version of this song to review.
Bernard spends more than a few seconds afterwards tuning his guitar.
Denial doesn't feature much in the way of its normal lyrics, either.
At 2:20 of Denial, Barney sings about how he "just can't take it no more." (for about 30 seconds). At 4:45, it sounds like he's singing "inside a club!, inside my world!, inside a ____ ____ club club" as the song comes abruptly to a halt.
(or is he singing 'pub' instead of 'club'?)
The final song, Everythings__Gone___Green_ has a very interesting filter effect that isn't present in later versions...I think it's the same one present in 'Prime 586' though. The song elements are really isolated, and I think the instrumental interplay is effective...and there's a brief tempo speed-up at about 1:35 in. The lyrics, which start at 3:45, are the typical improvisational ones typical for this period. "Down by the boardwalk...". Like the yelled out "Help me, somebody help me" at 6:45.
This version ends up being almost 13 minutes.
N.B. Can you all see the progression from the improvised EGG james ("...down by the boardwalk") to Blue Monday? ("..the beach")...?
Everything's Gone Green-->Prime 586-->Blue Monday
Source is from TJ. Fairly hissy source, but better than nothing at all.
Chosen__Time_ and Ceremony start things off.
Somebody says something in Finnish.
Everything's__Gone___Green_
Drums echo to an colossal degree, before Hooky's bass takes over. That's likely due to the venue acoustics.
In_A__Lonely___Place_
Stereo shift at 0:14 or so. Another one at 2:00. This one otherwise sounds a bit off pitch-wise.
ICB follows. Sound like mic getting bumped at 3:38. Then Senses.
Dreams__Never___End_
Another stereo shift at 0:40.
And then Denial.
Temptation
The debut, otherwise known as Taboo No. 7.
Source is off the master (in .flac format) posted by the taper ("booomboom") on the sharingthegroove.org forums. Sound is outstanding, enough to make any errors in the performance that much audible.
Notes (verbatim from forum)
"taped this show from the first row of the balcony, the quality is amazing for an audience recording. Stephen told me after the show, it was much better to do 40 min of high energy, than to do 120 min of a boring show , and this show from New Order is pure energy. Believe me , it's one of the best shows from 1981 ,and I saw a lot of shows from New Order in this year. Better from the music is the Hamburg Show, but the quality is only very good from the HH. show. But Hamburg has the best versions of "Everything`s gone green " I ever heard."
Chosen__Time_ has a brief cut 3:10 in.
Opening keyboards to In_A__Lonely___Place_ are badly off-key.
Somebody hits a bum note at 0:39 of Dreams__Never___End_.
Hooky sings "make these feelings go away" as the last lines, which isn't something I've regularly heard for that track.
Truth features an echoed whoop.
At the end of Procession, the taper says, "Can you get lost, 'cause we're working 'ere...fookin' hell man. What a fucking mess."
Everythings__Gone___Green_ is 10:43, and has a false start (15 seconds, drums only).
Very good guitar work here. One of the best versions of this track that I've heard.
To quote an article (Avant! Issue #1):
"At Bradford in late '81 a dour Peter Hook confronted the boistorous audience with the words, 'If you knew what had happened, you wouldn't be so fucking cheerful." You could have heard a pin drop."
Soundcheck
A minute or so of talking, nothing I can make out. Maybe a reference to Terry (Mason) in there.
Chosen__Time_
Fadeout/fadein at 1:40 or so. (on another version, this is a cut) Vocals somewhat faint.
Temptation follows.
BS: "One two one two". Then follows a tiny bit of Denial, before the tape cuts.
AC1 adds:
"I've just listened to the end of my Bradford 81 tape and there is (technically) a snippet of 'Little Dead', but it's no more than Steve doing a couple of drumrolls, un-accompanied. It doesn't cut out - he just stops playing after a few bars and no one picks it up again. I wouldn't/didn't bother to list it."
From STG posting by 'snotters':
This gig sees New Order as noise terrorists! Just about everything that can go wrong, does go wrong here. The first couple of minutes of Hurt (debuted here at the Ritz) has to do battle with the hapless dj still playing music over the p.a.! Then the "hum" prevailent throughout a lot of the gig starts at the beginning of In A Lonely Place - an annoying hum going through the p.a. which the tape picks up! Barney eventually suggests to the sound guy to turn off ALL the lights - that seems to do the trick.
There's a classic Gillian-related blooper - she plays Senses in the wrong key, for the duration of the entire song!
But in typical New Order style they turn disaster into triumph by playing what is in my opinion one of THE most powerful live performances they ever gave, in Everything's Gone Green. Well, a piece of sonic experimantalism loosely based on Everything's Gone Green, at least. It's so powerful it hurts!! It thunders along relentlessly for 15 minutes like a juggernaut - play this one LOUD and see what I mean!
The quality, despite the p.a. problems, is in my view pretty good - on a par with Hull 82 I would say. Plus this tape has some amusing audience banter (including some booing at the end of the set - surely a first for a New Order recording?!).
And craigie* has made a copy of his master available, which is even better than the Snotters' version.
My notes:
As relayed by 'snotters', you can still here snippets of the PA music over the intro of </u>Hurt</u>, which is debuted here.
(Snotters) Punters at 1:40:
girl: "I'm cutting now[out?]"
guy1: "You're staying..."
guy2: "Get out of the fucking way..."
guy3: "We're all piggybacked..."
guy2: "I know."
Great improvised melodica, it's jazz-like in feel.
Buzzing really starts up between Hurt and </u>In A Lonely Place</u>.
(Snotters)
guy: "[something] match...drum-fest..." guy: "background noise in the f..." There's a brief edit in the tape at 0:29.
The craigie* version has different banter here.
BS: "Maybe it's in the foldback..." Somebody then imitates a radio dispatcher's distorted muttering. Synth fires off randomly, too.
Incredibly enough, Bernard sings through all the din.
(at the end we have this interesting conversation between the band and the
PH: "Jon...(?)...Anything like this is with the lights, this happened on the last one...[muttering, hard-to-decipher]...geez"
(Jon = Jon Hurst?)
BS: "All the hu... the lights can take all the lights out."
BS(?): "I'm real sorry."
PH: "Sorry."
BS: "Try again...it's not going up front."
voice: "No, it's going up front...but there's a bit on the, on this synth as well...maybe the lights are triggering the synth, being real sensitive." [presumably the crew handling the lighting rig]
BS: "I'm real sorry about this."
Punter comments, "Like a fucking science class, this is, innit?"
You can hear this on both versions, louder on the Snotters version, as the person who may have said this may have been very close to the taper. On the craigie* version, this person sounds a few feet away to the left.
<u>Dreams Never End</u>
Still more buzzing.
BS: "Just break the lights, Rob, just forget them." That seems to quiet the buzzing.
(at end)
BS: "Will you turn the back lights up a bit, please."
punter #1 (on both versions, more distant on craigie*): "Wot was that?" punter #2 (satiated): "That'll do".
<u>Truth</u>
More problems. Gillian fires off the intro sequence to Hurt instead, and has to switch back to the right one.
Bernard injects a few extra whoops, the antecedent of what is now a somewhat annoying vocal idiosyncracy of his.
<u>Procession</u>
A bit of guitar tuning before the synth starts in.
punter: "This is the new one".
lyrics: "Hits me where it hurts me, hits me where it hurts me, so hard."
Boing effects, and more tuning.
<u>Senses</u>
As reported, Gillian's synth bit is completely off.
Yet more tuning, and a brief edit between tracks.
<u>Chosen Time</u>
And still more tuning after this one. Punter says "Ceremony", but instead gets the pounding drums of </u>Denial</u>. The synths go out of tune again for a bit.
Unique bass-and-drums ending, very nice!
<u>Everythings Gone Green</u>
This version is almost sixteen minutes long, and has a popping/gurgling bass sequencer effect I've not heard elsewhere.
(Snotters)
punter1: "Thought this is the long one."
punter2: "Eh?"
punter1: [repeating himself] "Thought this is the long one."
Very good punishing, aggressive version.
punter (at 13:54): "I want that...[mumble}"
Most people cheer, but somebody very close to the taper (if not the taper himself) emits a loud "Boo". Not sure if this is heartfelt or not. Music comes over the PA just as the tape fades out on Snotters' version, where craigie*'s version fades out right before that.
Not sure if this is a copy of audience master from JM, as there's a bit more hiss on the source than on the Market St. gig (maybe it was recorded at a quieter level), and it doesn't sound as dynamic, which could be chalked to venue acoustics. It's a better performance, though...except for Dreams Never End, which is pretty awful here.
Some of the songs appear on the 'Isolation' bootleg, the excerpt pertaining to it is the following:
Side 2 is New Order recorded on a bad day on a date I can only guess to be late 1980 or perhaps most probably early 1981. Sound quality is about VG."
Side 2 : Dreams Never End, Denial, Senses, and Ceremony
This is a shitty release. The Joy Division songs have all been on record before. And the New Order songs should not have been on record. Especially Dreams Never End is so bad you will not believe it.
Totally worthles, stay clear.
Writeup
Hurt
Third time played, also an instrumental.
Taper misses the intro part. Tape garbles between 1:20 - 1:23.
Chosen__Time_
Tape squels as it's restarted.
Procession follows.
Somebody close to the taper mutters at about 1:57 or so. Garble at 2:25. Fairly clean edit at end.
Truth and Senses follow.
Squeal edit between these two. At the end of Senses:
BS: "Let's see, I'm not getting any vocal through the foldback, [name]"
Tape squeal edit. Some tuning (tape garbles a bit here), and another squeal edit, missing the very first part of the next number, Dreams__Never___End_.
A bit of tape trouble starting at 1:45.
Another tape edit between this one and Denial.
A bit of talking starting at 2:45.
Two squeal edits before the start of Ceremony.
Stop/restart edit, rather than a squeal.
Temptation closes out the set, but cuts after about eight minutes.
lyric: "Three and four make seven."
Otherwise, it has the usual improvisations for this number. Excellent guitar work by Bernard!
A couple of drop outs (like the mic plug was getting pulled out) at about 3:30. Drop out at 6:03 as well. Some more audience chatter can be heard at 6:20.
And this one, at about 7:00 in.
lyric: "Oh it's so bad, Oh it's so bad, Oh, it's just me, oh it's just me! Here today, Here today".
A shame that this cuts out at 8:06!
Sound is clear, if a few generations away from the master and a bit boomy/clipped. Have a better M/2 version from TJ
Right channel cuts out for a bit after In_A__Lonely___Place_. (original version, not a problem with the TJ version)
A bit of a feedback squall before Dreams__Never___End_.
Chosen__Time_ on the TJ version has a phase shift at about 3:36 or so.
ICB
On the TJ version, the phase shifts back at 1:07 or so. This happens again at 3:07, and switches back at the end of this track.
Edit between ICB and Senses, as well as one between Senses and Ceremony.
There's a bit of warbliness on the TJ source on that track at the start (probably due to his source tape). This isn't present on the older version, so it's probably not a defect on the master. There's also a volume drop at somewhat past the 2:00 point, and a brief dropout (3:50 with TJ and 3:44 with the old version) present in both versions.
A tremendous amount of reverb on Bernard's vocals in Denial.
Temptation is nine minutes long, and is similar to the version that made it to the FAC71 video. Some interesting guitar work here.
The TJ version has a pop at about 0:57 that the original version doesn't have, and also seems to have more tape stability issues, though better definition that the Nth gen older version.
New Order do not talk to the audience at all, by the way.
Sounds 19 Nov 81
Live Review by Tim Sommer
(includes photo)
http://www.new-order.net/terminal1.demon.co.uk/NewMM12-81live.htm
NOTES
Tim Sommer later became an MTV VJ (Postmodern MTV in the late 80s) and was the bassist in Hugo Largo. I remember watching an episode where he highly complimented the band's early sound, as you will see when you read the article. He was not so sanguine as to New Order's later (synthesised) direction.
Meanwhile, here's another review of the same gig. I'm amazed I haven't transcribed this, as it is readily available.
Date: Tue Mar 20 12:44:16 1990
From: CAR-RT SORT
Subject: early no gig review...
Hi Again!
I was rummaging through some trash I've collected over the years and came across some copies of some underground magazines from New York circa 1980-1982. Since the Taras Shevchenko (sp?) video has been mentioned a bit lately I thought I'd type in a review from that gig. The magazine was called "Non LP B Side". I've collected almost every issue published. It started out free and ended up costing 75 cents. If anyone has any copies which they're tired of, mail me, maybe we can work out a trade! Ed
NEW ORDER Nov. 19, 1981
Walking down St. Mark's familiar path, droplets pissing down, droves of dark overcoated souls seemed drawn to some unknown destination. What could have been driving these purposeful people in this strange almost mystic way? NEW ORDER UKRAINIAN HALL THURSDAY NIGHT. What were we looking for? The answer to some rhetorical question, a message from the dead, or maybe just a good gig. I'd seen them before, a disgruntled gloomy lot, and I felt an intruder to their private misery, but this was different. An unfamiliar venue, the Ukraine seldom sees conventional "rock" gigs, and will surely not see another like this one. Due to Chase Parks' untimely closing Factory Records (Michael Shamburg) and Ruth Polski were forced to find an alternate venue for New Order. At the last moment they brought in full lighting, video and a sound system capable of making a 24 track recording of the event. The sound was wonderful in light of the haste, with minimal feed-back and sputtering, the lighting was eerie and yellowish. The D.J. set the atmosphere nicely by kindly omitting all those songs we are conditioned to hearing in clubs, no one danced, the air was full of anticipation.
Ike Yard, a recent Factory signing was first up. I'm afraid they are much better on record, as they left a few unprofessionally long gaps between songs, and seemed to have some difficulties. They were, however, interesting, and I'm sure they'll be better after live practice. Finally New Order took the stage and all stretched to see their faces. Most striking was Gillian Gilbert, with her white face and burgundy hair. She spent most of the evening crouched over her synthesizer or intently watching the fingerboard of her guitar. It seems that New Order's idea of stage presence is none at all. It is the music that is important, not the posture. Bernard Albrecht did most of the vocals, and provided the melodies with his careful guitar. He was as intense as ever, seeming ill at ease and earnest at once.
The set was perfect, sublime, uplifting. It is hard to remember which songs came when, though I do remember, "Procession" blending into "Ceremony" was beautiful. They did a lot of material from the new album MOVEMENTS [sic]. "Dreams Never End", sung by Peter Hook was especially moving. The last song, and toure de force was definitely "Temptation", which will probably be the next single. Bernard was left singing and staring Heaven-ward, hopefully. This was not the New Order I remembered, there was no gloom. They did not seem to conjure Ian's ghost. This New Order was a complete unit with powerful ideas and music of their own.
The show left me jubilant, joyful, like a weight removed from my shoulder. New Order will mourn no more. They have come to grips with the present and the music will [win] out. I have, the answer to my question; Life goes on.
Dec Hickey's fabulous 'From Heaven To Heaven' quotes the following setlist for this show:
The Him
Dreams Never End
Procession
Truth
Senses
Chosen Time
Denial
Ceremony
IALP
There's a high pitched whine throughout on my source.
Probably one of the poorest-quality I have. Luckily, an upgrade surfaced that has none of the defects detailed below
In_A__Lonely___Place_
Feedback during the first bit.
Dreams__Never___End_
Somebody calls out "Warsaw" beforehand.
Chosen__Time_
Bernard's vocals are higher in pitch at the start, and there's also a bit of feedback here.
ICB
A bit of a strange version, with a very spare feel, and an insistent drum pattern.
Senses
Band tune up. Same guy calls for Warsaw again. Sound on this one is extremely loud, distorting on the tape. Also some glitches with the way this plays back on CD.
Denial is similarly distorted, as well as the rest of the songs here.
Short version of Everythings__Gone___Green_.
Hurt follows. Sounds like an instrumental.
Segues into Temptation, performed in the same way as on other US '81 gigs.